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Username Post: LS1 swap short list of quest/answer        (Topic#63186)
77chevy 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 3608
77chevy
Loc: trusting earth to a boys ...
Reg: 01-26-01
04-15-04 02:50 PM - Post#429372    

Several questions need to be asked before you swap in an LS1(into any car) here are just a few with some simple answers (keep in mind if you consider swapping in an LS1 into a V6 or LT1 FBody you still need a lot more donor parts and may be simpler to just buy an LS1 car):

-Which LS1? Vette is throttle by wire (no acl pedal tied a cable) or FBody(as do trucks) does have a throttle cable. The decision is best left to the completeness of the items you can acquire (like an entire wrecked Vette). The engine mounts on the LS1 are further forward on the block. Also don't forget the iron brothers from trucks 4.8, 5.3 and 6L.

-Headers? Several companies make shortie headers (JBA, Edelbrock etc) but most of these are designed for the Vette or FBody (and long tube headers gives the LS1 more than ample breathing, but shorties do look better than stock exhaust manifolds(that first versions of the FBody were prone to crushing the inner pipe of the exhaust manifold, that means 2 pieces inside of the LS1 manifold/inner pipe and outer pipe). 2000-2002 Fbodies got dif exhaust manifolds (no inner pipes). Some aftermarkets have picked up on the swap and are making headers like Stainless Works, but be prepared for possibly building your own headers (esp if you want long tube headers).

-Electronics stock or aftermarket? Several companies are making aftermarket electronics, Fast Accel are the top few. Unless your seriously modifying I would suggest sticking to the stock computer (LG is using a stock FBody computer in his trans am race car http://www.lgmotorsports.com/LGM_Racing.htm) esp if you got a complete harness and computer from a donor car

-Harness? Painless wiring and several others make kits for wiring (but they are based on stock computer/cars). Keep the harness in mind when you get an engine/trans, because if you are going after a high perf build the Accell kit may be the best solution (Accell's G7 has an option to include the harness)

-Which transmission? 4L60E/A4 or M6(which has a different bolt pattern) I will not touch the 10K other transmission options because I will consider the transmission came from the donor car. The M6 has a hydraulic clutch so some fabrication or the pedal assembly will be required. The A4 is computer controlled so you need the computer, but keep in mind you could reflash your computer for a M6(if going from A4-4L60E to manual or th350/th400 trans).

-Oil pan? The Vette oil pan has a kickouts that could interfere, keep in mind you have 3 choices of stock pans Vette, FBody and now GTO(which I have not seen but assume it is a different front sump).

-Fuel Pressure? True with almost any fuel injection swap you will now need a high pressure fuel system (58psi for LS1). So if your fuel tank doesn't have a high pressure pump you will need an aftermarket one (DON'T FORGET THE HIGH PRESSURE FUEL FILTER TOO).

-Clearance? Yup you guessed it, you may have clearance issues with suspension(and esp steering components) and the LS1. The LS1 is about 2-3 inches wider than a typical sbc and is 12-13 inches from the bellhousing to center of the motormounts. You may need to convert to front steer for added clearance (and watch strut/shock towers too).



With those few simple questions answered here are some useful links (disclaimer I neither endorse nor am I selling any products referenced here):



These guys out TX seem to have written the bible on the LS1/LS6 swap(with some good detailed info):

http://www.hpsalvage.com/

Edelbrock's manifold/MSD ignition module part no #7118 because it not only fits the famous 5.7 Vette/FBody but also the LM7 (5.3L), LR4 (4.8L), and LQ4 (6.0L) and also includes a special throttle and trans bracket that works with 700R-4 and Turbo 350 (ie retrofit):
http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/new2004/manifolds.html

Yearone's link:
http://www.yearone.com/enthusiast/articles/69camaro/69camaro.html

Project "Extreme-G"/69 SS
http://users.ev1.net/~ynot_dv8/69Camaro/Website/Code/ExtremeG.html




 




76-Elky 
Senior Member
Posts: 191
76-Elky
Loc: Rose Hill KS
Reg: 10-16-02
Re: LS1 swap short list of quest/answer
04-20-04 10:54 AM - Post#429373    
    In response to 77chevy

I'm in the preliminary planning stages on swapping an LS1 into my 76 elcamino. I would probably go with an auto trans and motor out of an F-body so that I can use the original type throttle wire. Exhaust gets a little tricky, but I would probably make due with the factory manifolds for a while. I would like to get all the stock wiring from the donor car. Obviously a new driveshaft will have to be made along with custom tranny mounts. Here are my questions:

1. What type of motor mounts should be used or am I going to have to fab my own?
2. Will the 4L60E fit in my transmission tunnel?
3. Can my current air conditioning and power steering lines be joined with the factory parts on the engine?
4. Is the oil pan a rear sump style?
5. How many splines are on the driveshaft input?
6. Should I set the motor foward in order to use factory style motor mounts.

I'm sure I will have more questions, but I can't think of them now. Feel free to post anything that I forgot.

76 Elcamino - 388 stroker, 4.10 gears, best et to date 13.14 @ 101 mph in the quarter so far.


 
77chevy 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 3608
77chevy
Loc: trusting earth to a boys ...
Reg: 01-26-01
Re: LS1 swap short list of quest/answer
04-20-04 02:17 PM - Post#429374    
    In response to 76-Elky

Watch the LS1 drive accs, AC, alt etc are low mount and can interfere with front cross member.



1.Pretty certain you will need to fab engine mounts 4 bolts drilled into flat piece of steel with ears welded on to fit the orig 70's clam shell mount (this will allow you move the engine forwards or backwards before you weld the ears for 1-3 inches of travel for/aft). I don't know of any retrofit kits yet.

2.trans tunnel should be big enough to handle it

3.AC lines will prob not work because it is mounted on the bottom of the engine the power sterring you should be able to fab these to work

4.fbody is rear sump that extends from the rear of the engine foirward about 11.5 inches. It may interfer with 2 braces from cross member to frame if you still have them (same bracket/brace reason I couldn't get the starter off my Bu)

5.I don't know the number of splines will try to find out tho (you better bet a custom length shaft will be needed (avoid the stock alum? fbody they have been known to unravel like christmas wrapping paper)

6.I would try to test fit first, but the alt will def clear better with motor mounts moved forward. Keep in mind the bolt on motor mount(mentioned in no 1 above before you weld it) can give you 1-3 inches of movement for tweaking.




here are some measurements thanks to http://www.hpsalvage.com/
65 lbs. lighter than LT1(that weights 525lbs)
26" Bellhousing flange to crank pulley
28" Bellhousing flange to front of water pump
25" Bottom oil pan to top of manifold
12.5" Bellhousing flange to center of motor mount
15" Bottom of oil pan to bottom of exhaust ports
26" Wide to outside of exhaust manifolds


I will try my best to help exp since my 77bu has the engine/trans out and an 02Z28 is sitting right next to it. But keep in mind you need to test fit this can only be rough est measurements. Now I can't waite to wreck the 02Z28 and put it all in the 77Bu !

Dan



 
C350 
Very Senior Member
Posts: 1345
C350
Loc: Texas
Reg: 09-07-01
Re: LS1 swap short list of quest/answer
04-21-04 06:15 PM - Post#429375    
    In response to 77chevy

77Chevy, very useful and informative post. You or Smoking should Pin this up so it doesn't get archived. It would do alot of good since like in the Third Gen section, engine swaps are common questions asked among members.

2007 Chevrolet Suburban Lt (three-quarter ton)
1966 Chevrolet Impala Station Wagon



 
Ryan M. 
Member
Posts: 36
Ryan M.
Loc: Cleveland, TN
Reg: 05-09-05
Re: LS1 swap short list of quest/answer
05-11-05 05:28 PM - Post#429376    
    In response to C350

if you have any questions give me or scott a call at tennessee auto 18008847501 and check out some of the pictures from the swaps

Tennessee Auto Projects

We have done a few swaps including a 69 camaro full frame car, 72 chevrolet pickup, 1980 el camino, 1954 international pickp, and my 1994 trans am with 6.0l ls1 and 6 speed.

We will do out best to answer your questions.

1981 Chevrolet C10


 
davidh 
Senior Member
Posts: 562
davidh
Loc: Oklahoma
Reg: 02-17-01
Re: LS1 swap short list of quest/answer
10-01-05 06:01 PM - Post#429377    
    In response to Ryan M.

I plan on putting this EFI motor in a 65 chevelle. Haven't seen it done yet but there's a 67 with it done so I'm sure a 65 isn't too far off.

david


 
Anonymous 

Re: LS1 swap short list of quest/answer
10-17-06 12:26 AM - Post#429378    
    In response to 76-Elky

I am installing an LQ4 (cast iron block version of the 6.0 liter LS2, almost) into my '39 Chevy sedan. Check the picture trail link in my signature for photos. The engine will bolt in with commercially available plates that bolt to the block and use standard small block mounts ( I used Corvette mounts). If you can you may opt for a tuck oil pan if the one you have isn't going to clear. Block hugger headers work in most cases and there are some long tube headers available for swaps. Check out LS1.com before you buy anything! They have the most information on swaps for these engines. Computers can be sent to one of several vendors who will re-flash them for significantly more power and removal of uneccesary wiring. The A/C compressor is low and on narrow frames like my '39, I had to cout a notch to clear the compressor and it's still VERY close to the bottom radiator hose. You will need to modify your radiator unless you have a LOT of room for the bottom hose in your chassis. Again, see my photos for a close up.
Good luck with your swap, sounds like a good one!



 
kieth 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 87

Loc: Tulsa, Oklahoma
Reg: 08-05-10
12-26-10 10:48 AM - Post#2022787    
    In response to 77chevy

Lots of info in your post here is a link to a shop that solves one of the LT1 problems. It allows one to use std sbc chevy motor mounts and perches (my 65 chevy p/up) and not spend a fortune.

http://www.brrs.efishant.com/index.php?option=com_...

This bracket moves the compressor to drivers side upper area instead of passenger side lower . Kieth



 




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