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Username Post: Power steering conversion        (Topic#364156)
timmins57 
Newbie
Posts: 4

Reg: 04-21-09
01-29-21 08:46 AM - Post#2813195    

Thinking about adding power steering to my 57. Leaning towards a cpp500 conversion kit and changing original steering column to a tilt. Anyone done this conversion and what are all the parts required.

Old Chevy's never die , they just get moved to the Garage Mahal! 57 210 sport coupe, 69 Camaro SS, 1936 truck, 1957 truck


 


timo_pajala 
Newbie
Posts: 10

Age: 42
Loc: -
Reg: 12-04-20
01-31-21 11:09 AM - Post#2813343    
    In response to timmins57

I made the swap earlier, you have to shorten the axle and the axle Tube and buy the joint to hook the axle to the cpp steering box. Ragjoint might be good, I bought stainless Steel double d coupler to hook them together. You also have to shave the axle end to D shape to get the joint part hook in



 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
02-01-21 07:35 AM - Post#2813399    
    In response to timmins57

hello, welcome to the PS party!
The big day and excitement of the PS Kit coming in the mail is
soon forgotten once this project gets under way. There are numerous methods to achieve ps.
here is a few posts I made on the issues.

Post#2540096
Post#2777015
and yes it really is like driving a go-cart now

VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


 
57tim 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 3108
57tim
Loc: Cameron, Wi, USA
Reg: 11-09-01
02-01-21 01:42 PM - Post#2813419    
    In response to timmins57

Just a warning about the tilt wheel. It sticks out from the dash about 2-2.5 inches further then the non tilt column and it forces you to drive like a NASCAR driver with the steering wheel close to your chest.

I had the tilt, IDIDIT brand, and I found out I rarely used the tilt and I had to move my seat back a couple inches to be comfortable driving. The IDIDIT is a great product and please don't buy a Chinese tilt column because they are junk dangerous.

57 Bel Air 2dr Ht
327 700r4
http://www.picturetrail.com/tmneid


 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
02-12-21 06:16 AM - Post#2814158    
    In response to timmins57

Has the party started?

VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


 
elvis 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 892
elvis
Loc: Ontario
Reg: 11-10-05
03-09-21 03:52 PM - Post#2815837    
    In response to Bad56Sedan

I'm also looking at installing the CPP 500 power steering upgrade kit on our '57 Bel Air.
We have the original A-arms installed. Do we need to replace these to increase the positive caster?
We're also running Hooker Comp Headers (part # 2458). Is there adequate clearance for the 500 box?
Thanks



 
elvis 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 892
elvis
Loc: Ontario
Reg: 11-10-05
03-10-21 04:58 AM - Post#2815861    
    In response to elvis

I spoke with Chris in tech at CPP after posting my previous reply. He said the positive caster is for ensuring the car will track in a straight line and the steering wheel will return to centre.
I'm waiting for a reply from Hooker about the clearance with the headers.

Pouring money between the wheels.


 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-10-21 04:25 PM - Post#2815899    
    In response to elvis

hooker comps will clear,
this is the 2nd,3rd or 4th attempt,
note 3 grove crank pulley,2 groove alt pulley and 2 groove water pump pulley,
this method did not work


Attachment: DSCN8437.JPG (329.01 KB) 19 View(s)




VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


Edited by Bad56Sedan on 03-10-21 05:05 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-10-21 04:28 PM - Post#2815900    
    In response to Bad56Sedan

this was another attempt to use single water pump pulley and double crank pulley did not work
notice the extreme misalignment on the PS belt and crank pulley


Attachment: FSCN7572.JPG (137.06 KB) 20 View(s)




VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


Edited by Bad56Sedan on 03-10-21 04:31 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-10-21 04:30 PM - Post#2815901    
    In response to Bad56Sedan

hooker comp headers and original a-arms

Attachment: IMG_1254.JPG (150.73 KB) 17 View(s)




VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-10-21 04:33 PM - Post#2815902    
    In response to Bad56Sedan

lot of issues where due to the way the lower radiator hose would not clear the belt in the first crank groove on the engine side,

the higher dollar lower hose is a bit different and the 90° bend is a lot better

and the radiator location
and electric fans,

like i said in the first post, there is a lot of ways to get this project done,
what I have posted may or may not work in yours or anyone else's situation,
I am not saying it will, this is just merely to point out what I ran into,
several other questions can be asked also,
but the end result is my car really does steering like a go cart now

VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


Edited by Bad56Sedan on 03-10-21 05:10 PM. Reason for edit: i am not an engineer, metallurgist or a spelling bee champion

 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-10-21 05:17 PM - Post#2815907    
    In response to Bad56Sedan

none of the previous posted picture are the end result,
at first I refused to move the radiator into the 6 Cylinder position
( I do not claim this has to be done, just in my situation it worked )
Then I figured since I was doing all this I should just do the electric fan thing,
( No, you don't have to have electric fans, you can use a mechanical fan,
I do not claim electric fans are the only way to get there )
Yeah I bought the fans from one of the various repop parts boutiques,
they might cool if you never start the engine, so I replaced those with the fans from lleh, and I have no issues,
( I am not saying a 36" 20 blade mechanical fan wont work,
I'm just saying get bigger fans than you think you need, remove all doubt )

VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


Edited by Bad56Sedan on 03-10-21 05:18 PM. Reason for edit: it's really a shame when you have to include disclaimers

 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-10-21 05:38 PM - Post#2815909    
    In response to Bad56Sedan

Here is the end result
Notice the alternator is changed back to single groove pulley and on passenger side, belt is in the first crank grove.
Ps pump is in second crank and second water pump groove, third crank groove not used.
Notice fans from LLeh in second picture.
So what I showed is ONLY one method,
Could I have just bought the serpentine setup?
Yeah but this looks tougher and fits the look of my car,
Could I have had someone that don't know diddly do it?
Yeah, but no thanks,
"doing it your self, is priceless!"


Attachment: image.jpg (110.86 KB) 19 View(s)




Attachment: image.jpg (107.86 KB) 20 View(s)




Attachment: image.jpg (120.15 KB) 22 View(s)




VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


 
elvis 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 892
elvis
Loc: Ontario
Reg: 11-10-05
03-10-21 05:40 PM - Post#2815911    
    In response to Bad56Sedan

Wow. That was terrific. Do you have a photo of your final set-up?
Are you still using the original upper A-Arms? If so, how does the car track (I'm guessing like a go-kart ) and how well does the steering wheel return to center?
If we don't need to replace the upper A-Arms, that would be terrific. Chris at CPP said the box won't be damaged if we don't replace the upper A-Arms with something providing 5 degree positive caster.

Pouring money between the wheels.


 
elvis 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 892
elvis
Loc: Ontario
Reg: 11-10-05
03-10-21 05:42 PM - Post#2815912    
    In response to elvis

We just overlapped and I'll have a look at the end result photos. Thanks!

Pouring money between the wheels.


 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-10-21 05:44 PM - Post#2815913    
    In response to Bad56Sedan


how did you get the pulleys to line up?
I don't like how the power steering pump housing is tilted.

One of the big places that sells all kinds of after market items has "Pulley Shims".
I'm sure eventually I will discover the PS Pump i'm looking for.



VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-10-21 06:01 PM - Post#2815915    
    In response to elvis

It does come back to center,
This car had a front end alignment prior to all the fun, how much caster or camber it has I really don't know,
just the now out of business alignment shop had no issues and was able to align it.
It truly is one finger steering now.
Like one of the other posts on this thread mentioned the tilt wheel could be an issue,
but getting that rag joint in the column is worth it with or with out tilt.
this may or may not lead to complete front seat disassembly...
that's another thread



VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


 
elvis 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 892
elvis
Loc: Ontario
Reg: 11-10-05
03-10-21 06:40 PM - Post#2815918    
    In response to Bad56Sedan

Currently, we're running 2 groove pulleys on the crank and Tuff Stuff short water pump. No power steering pump yet. The Vintage Air compressor is mounted wide on the passenger side and the alternator is mounted wide on the driver side.
We'll need to change the crank pulley to a triple and run 1 groove to the power steering pump.

We also need to switch from the pulley driven rad fan to am electric puller set-up. Space is tight. We'll get there next. We installed a desert cooler 4 core rad. Cool, original look with better performance.

We're using the stock original A-arms with new bushings. I really didn't want to change them if it's not necessary.

Pouring money between the wheels.


 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-10-21 06:54 PM - Post#2815920    
    In response to elvis

One more,
" if you didn't use the 3rd crank pulley why didn't you swap back to the two groove crank pulley you had in one of the pictures?"

I tried it, the water pump pulley is after market, thicker between groves and would not line up with GM double crank pulley.

Why didn't you get a two groove GM water pump pulley?

Notice the ps pump is basically In Front of the block, this is the set distance to work from and determines where the pulleys will line up. This alignment can only be adjusted outward, because the pump is against the block.
Why didn't you get a different PS pump pulley?

I did, I now have three extras taking up shelf space.
What have I not covered?

VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-10-21 06:57 PM - Post#2815921    
    In response to elvis

AC is another issue,
Hope my posts help

"how long did it take to figure out the lower radiator hose issue"



VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


Edited by Bad56Sedan on 03-10-21 07:01 PM. Reason for edit: I laugh now, but I was po'd trying to figure out the pulley issue

 
elvis 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 892
elvis
Loc: Ontario
Reg: 11-10-05
03-13-21 06:25 AM - Post#2816059    
    In response to Bad56Sedan

Your information is terrific. I feel relieved about the upper A-arms and your comment about positive caster. I didn't want to replace the A-arms if we didn't have to.
Thanks for your help. I life is good for you in the great state of Texas.

Pouring money between the wheels.


 
docjns1 
"2nd Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 186
docjns1
Loc: upstate NY
Reg: 11-12-19
03-15-21 05:25 PM - Post#2816241    
    In response to timmins57

From personal experience I can confirm adding a degree or 2 (or 3...) will definitely help with return to center.
While you don't mention what engine you're running, with my bone stock '65 327 and the 500 series set-up I had several issues with their brackets, pulley alignment and in my case left side alternator clearance. After another $90 for alt brackets that still didn't fit (their answer is moving the alt higher up with a kit made for tall valve covers...doesn't work with an earlier oil fill & temp sender in the front of the intake), I ended up finding some used OEM pump brackets and problem solved. Still need a 3 groove crank pulley as p/s runs off outer most groove....2nd (middle) groove is used for AC for those cool enough to have it

...yes, pun intended

Attachment: 20191115_234244.jpg (1.93 MB) 19 View(s)


'65 CPP brackets


Attachment: 20200707_203227.jpg (2.16 MB) 21 View(s)


finished w/ OE brackets


Steve
*********
'65 Impala SS, Crocus Yellow/blk
327 / 300 L74
M11 3 on the tree
12 bolt 3.31 open dif


 
elvis 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 892
elvis
Loc: Ontario
Reg: 11-10-05
03-15-21 05:41 PM - Post#2816242    
    In response to docjns1

Good info. We're running a 355 sbc. Alternator mounted top driver side, A/C compressor mounted top passenger side. Plan to mount the power steering bottom driver side. We'll definitely use a 3 groove crank pulley.

Pouring money between the wheels.


 
docjns1 
"2nd Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 186
docjns1
Loc: upstate NY
Reg: 11-12-19
03-15-21 06:37 PM - Post#2816245    
    In response to elvis

I'll assume with headers you'll have different bracket setup for the alternator which should give you clearance for p/s. As long as your oil fill is in the valve cover(s) and temp sender in the block or head the CPP/Alan Grove alternator brackets should work with the proper pulleys.

Steve
*********
'65 Impala SS, Crocus Yellow/blk
327 / 300 L74
M11 3 on the tree
12 bolt 3.31 open dif


 
Rick_L 
Member #409
Posts: 27856
Rick_L
Loc: Katy, Tx, USA
Reg: 07-06-00
03-16-21 10:09 AM - Post#2816264    
    In response to elvis

OEM setup wasn't a triple pulley, it was a double pulley with a single pulley in front of it.



 
elvis 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 892
elvis
Loc: Ontario
Reg: 11-10-05
03-16-21 02:16 PM - Post#2816274    
    In response to Rick_L

We're using brackets from the old Bill's Hot Rods.
Chris at Hooker (Holley) sent me an e-mail today and said the 605 steering box won't fit with the Hooker Comp headers. The 670/500 box is good.
Just became a gold member (again) today. Will post a photo or 2 of the brackets soon.

Pouring money between the wheels.


 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
03-16-21 05:21 PM - Post#2816289    
    In response to timmins57

All this info and we have not covered removing/replacing the old box,
and steering column removal and replace or modifications.



VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


 
elvis 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 892
elvis
Loc: Ontario
Reg: 11-10-05
03-16-21 05:51 PM - Post#2816292    
    In response to Bad56Sedan

That's funny. The manual box is already removed and the car sits on jack stands.
Here's a photo of the engine bay with the alt. & a/c brackets from Bill's Hot Rods. This photo still contains the manual box.

Attachment: Engine_bay_driver_side_08-20-12-1.jpg (40.98 KB) 25 View(s)




Pouring money between the wheels.


Edited by elvis on 03-16-21 05:52 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
elvis 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 892
elvis
Loc: Ontario
Reg: 11-10-05
05-01-21 10:51 AM - Post#2819084    
    In response to elvis

We received our 500 power steering box and column kit from CPP! I am stoked. We'll get started with our install and order the pump, pulleys, brackets and stainless braided lines & fittings next.
Our chassis and related components were painted gloss black using Imron.
Before we start the install, does anyone have any experience with the durability of the black paint applied to the CPP items?


Attachment: CPP_Steering_04-30-21.jpg (927.42 KB) 15 View(s)




Pouring money between the wheels.


 
Bad56Sedan 
"14th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1378
Bad56Sedan
Loc: Pasadena, Texas
Reg: 04-29-04
05-01-21 05:10 PM - Post#2819104    
    In response to elvis

you will enjoy PS,
good luck

wonder how the OP is doing on PS?

VC56S 2 door Sedan, 40 Years

[image]https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/fbbavatars/a v-3564-1354211547.jpg[/image]


Edited by Bad56Sedan on 05-01-21 05:11 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 


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