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Username Post: Short orange wire?        (Topic#361102)
fander 
"4th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 184
fander
Loc: Hot Springs South Dakota
Reg: 04-28-12
05-24-20 06:17 PM - Post#2794697    

I was under the dash today on my 62 and there is a green wire about eight inches long with a male connector. It comes out of the harness not too far from the fuse box. I accidentally grounded it and got a spark. I was curious what it is was for and pulled all the fuses and it is still at 12 volts. Any ideas? American Autowire harness.



 




lone star 
Contributor
Posts: 231

Reg: 08-24-08
05-25-20 10:04 AM - Post#2794753    
    In response to fander

American auto wires should be labeled on the wire. The orange wire my guess off top of my head is for interior dome light. Its probably hot because the door was open...



 
64ss409 
Senior Member
Posts: 941

Loc: Montana
Reg: 12-04-02
05-25-20 10:37 AM - Post#2794758    
    In response to lone star

If I remember correctly, the orange wire is hot to the dome light all the time and grounded at the door switch.
Ron

1964 SS 409/340 4 spd, bought new Oct '63 from Ken Boggs Chevrolet, Geraldine, Montana


 
turbo38s10 
"9th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1802
turbo38s10
Loc: Agawam,MA
Reg: 09-17-09
05-25-20 12:00 PM - Post#2794774    
    In response to 64ss409

orange or green?



 
pvs409 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 2923
pvs409
Loc: Sergeant Bluff, Iowa
Reg: 01-10-05
05-25-20 12:29 PM - Post#2794778    
    In response to fander

Glen,
your title says yellow wire but your comments say green wire that you are asking about.

I think you mean the green wire with a plastic connector and a half round clip that snaps onto the underdash round rod brace on 61 and 62's.

"That green wire I think plugs into the horn wire" from the steering column.
This green wire exits the tape wrapped main harness above the fuse box with the turn signalwire and plastic plug for the steering column in 61 and 62's and exits with the wiring with a plastic plug in connector for the rear wiring harness.

I have about 7 original harnesses removed complete from 61 to 63's and the green wire on some of them is paired (using a double plug) with a gray wire and a snap on clip for the brace rod under the dash. PG and stick might be the difference in two wires vs just one green wire.

Paul

57 BelairHT 283/270hp 4 spd
62 ImpHT 327/300 4 spd
62 Imp CV SS 327/300HP 700R4 (sold)
62 Imp HT SS 409/482 stroker 4 spd
62 Imp SS 409 - 5 spd Convertible
http://paulstensland.com


 
fander 
"4th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 184
fander
Loc: Hot Springs South Dakota
Reg: 04-28-12
05-25-20 12:31 PM - Post#2794779    
    In response to 64ss409

Thanks guys but that is bad news. No labels on the wires so probably not American autowire and I was hoping I could get some information from them. It has been three or four years ago that I ordered the harnesses and someone else installed it so I will have to try to figure out who made it. Got some serious electrical gremlins I will have to figure out.



 
pvs409 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 2923
pvs409
Loc: Sergeant Bluff, Iowa
Reg: 01-10-05
05-25-20 12:50 PM - Post#2794783    
    In response to fander

American Autowire sells two types of harnesses. The original stlye uses the factory fuse box and factory hole in the firewall with 2 mounting screws in the corners.

The aftermarket American Autowire harness uses a way different fuse box without the old style fuses, and requires cutting a new firewall hole and has ends on wires that need to be crimped.

The original American Autowire wiring harness for a 4 speed or a automatic has all plug in wiring and all the wires and complete(no crimping of wires...) and fit the original items on the car,

The tags on the original American Autowire harnesses are not very extensive, they could have easily been removed. The harnesses do not have tags on all the wires. If I recall right there might be only 1 to 3 tags on the new original harnesses.

Paul

57 BelairHT 283/270hp 4 spd
62 ImpHT 327/300 4 spd
62 Imp CV SS 327/300HP 700R4 (sold)
62 Imp HT SS 409/482 stroker 4 spd
62 Imp SS 409 - 5 spd Convertible
http://paulstensland.com


 
junky 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 3446

Loc: Northeast CT
Reg: 06-27-10
05-25-20 12:50 PM - Post#2794784    
    In response to fander

If it is hot all the time, then it would be for something that would work when the ignition is off. The dome light circuit is Orange for the positive side, and white for the ground(s) at the door switch in the A pillar. The horn wire is black, and it provides a path to ground and the hot side of the horn, is located at the horn relay on the firewall.
I would check to see if everything in the dash works properly, and also keep in mind that some of the wires are not used. What gauge is the wire that you found, and what color? A picture would be great to see where it exits the harness. Don't get yourself too wrapped up with loose ends on the harness. My 1962 BelAir has a few ends that are not connected to anything, and I have since learned that they were never intended to be connected to anything. GM must have been using the "one size fits all", and incorporated extra terminals so they only would need 1 harness for many applications. I only wish that my car had a wire in the harness for the clock. I would have to have an Impala wire harness for that.

Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level, then beat you with experience.


 
fander 
"4th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 184
fander
Loc: Hot Springs South Dakota
Reg: 04-28-12
05-25-20 01:11 PM - Post#2794786    
    In response to junky

Thanks fellows. I was just under the dash and it is a green wire with a clip like Paul mentioned. It was connected into an orange wire. Both 14 gauge I believe. The green wire connector is partially melted which makes me nervous even though I carry two CO2 extinguishers. The black horn wire is there but not connected. I unhooked the green wire as I figured it might be just dome lights but surprised when headlights, ignition switch and dome lights no longer work. It appears that green wire was feeding the whole system. I pulled all the fuses and that green wire is still hot. I hooked the green wire back up to the orange wire and everything works again except the front parking lights but they may have been out before. Challenging



 
64ss409 
Senior Member
Posts: 941

Loc: Montana
Reg: 12-04-02
05-25-20 02:29 PM - Post#2794795    
    In response to fander

You probably know this but just for info, the park lights go off when the switch is pulled all the way out for headlights on.
Ron

1964 SS 409/340 4 spd, bought new Oct '63 from Ken Boggs Chevrolet, Geraldine, Montana


 
fander 
"4th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 184
fander
Loc: Hot Springs South Dakota
Reg: 04-28-12
05-25-20 02:45 PM - Post#2794797    
    In response to 64ss409

Yes I know but I don't mind reminders. I have tail lights in both positions but no park lights in park position. I have vintage air which requires a switch to alternator and I am looking around in that area now except I have no schematic about which wire goes where for the alternator. I was also looking on this site as I have heard people talking about a modification to the horn when installing an alternator but I haven't found it yet. Thanks



 
DonSSDD 
Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 7340
DonSSDD
Loc: Nova Scotia, Canada
Reg: 08-21-01
05-25-20 02:57 PM - Post#2794799    
    In response to 64ss409

Have you checked the wiring diagrams in the shop manual/supplement? American Autowire follows the factory wiring colours. The assembly manual has the rpo options wiring.

63 Pontiac Parisienne Sport Coupe(CDN Chev mechanically (409, 4 speed),62 Bel Air SC (sold), 59 El Camino (sold), 62 Bel Air SC(sold), 63 SWC Vette (sold),
Member #2194


 
fander 
"4th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 184
fander
Loc: Hot Springs South Dakota
Reg: 04-28-12
05-26-20 06:54 PM - Post#2794929    
    In response to DonSSDD

I think I am gaining. The only wire going through the bulkhead that was 12 volts was the green horn wire. I do have an autowire harness which I am glad. The front harness is a 62 FR light harness with/63-65 voltage regulator. The regulator is a 63-68 voltage regulator. The alternator is a powermaster. I did not put this together myself and I do not see a horn relay which I am assuming is my problem in not having 12v on the red wire. Does someone have a picture of where this horn relay is supposed to go? I also need a source for a 63 wiring diagram. Thanks

Attachment: alternator.JPG (50.73 KB) 6 View(s)




Attachment: alternator.JPG (50.73 KB) 6 View(s)




Attachment: regulator.JPG (63.73 KB) 6 View(s)






 
pvs409 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 2923
pvs409
Loc: Sergeant Bluff, Iowa
Reg: 01-10-05
05-26-20 08:22 PM - Post#2794933    
    In response to fander

That

57 BelairHT 283/270hp 4 spd
62 ImpHT 327/300 4 spd
62 Imp CV SS 327/300HP 700R4 (sold)
62 Imp HT SS 409/482 stroker 4 spd
62 Imp SS 409 - 5 spd Convertible
http://paulstensland.com


 
pvs409 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 2923
pvs409
Loc: Sergeant Bluff, Iowa
Reg: 01-10-05
05-26-20 08:56 PM - Post#2794936    
    In response to pvs409

The 63 assembly manual clearly has a horn relay with 7 wires connected to it.
Here are the wires shown on the horn relay:
( Tan, black, gray/black/red, red/ red)
The diagram shows the horn relay mounted right below the voltage regulator and all the wires for the voltage regulator and the horn relay exit the wrapped wiring together.
I see a 2 wire extra plug in your picture ( not plugged in) by the Voltage regulator picture.


The alternator shows 5 wires on the wiring diagram: ( black, b/w, dbl, red/black)

dbl= dark blue

Paul

57 BelairHT 283/270hp 4 spd
62 ImpHT 327/300 4 spd
62 Imp CV SS 327/300HP 700R4 (sold)
62 Imp HT SS 409/482 stroker 4 spd
62 Imp SS 409 - 5 spd Convertible
http://paulstensland.com


 
ragtp66 
Contributor
Posts: 905

Reg: 12-09-07
05-26-20 09:26 PM - Post#2794939    
    In response to pvs409

Paul,

You are correct the green wire is for the single horn wire coming from the steering column. If it has the grey wire that feeds the light for the power glide shift indicator on the column.

Chris

Toys:
1958 Impala 2dr Hardtop Under Construction
1966 Chevelle Malibu Convert M20/350 Aztec Bronze
1987 Sea Ray Pachanga 22
2002 Cadillac Escalade EXT Parts chaser
2007 Trailblazer SS -gone and missed


 
ragtp66 
Contributor
Posts: 905

Reg: 12-09-07
05-26-20 09:29 PM - Post#2794940    
    In response to fander

The two wire connector by the voltage regulator should be connected to the missing horn relay.

Should also be a wire from horn relay to battery positive and to firewall bulkhead connector.

Depending on which kit was purchased for the dash there are 6 options 3 manual trans 3 auto and 3 different versions for each of the trim levels. Impala is usually stocked and can be used on the other trim levels you just end up with some added circuits for clock, glovebox and courtesy lights as well as reverse lights. Orange wires are hot all the time for dome/courtesy/glovebox. The greys are mostly cluster lights. Tans are hot key on.

Toys:
1958 Impala 2dr Hardtop Under Construction
1966 Chevelle Malibu Convert M20/350 Aztec Bronze
1987 Sea Ray Pachanga 22
2002 Cadillac Escalade EXT Parts chaser
2007 Trailblazer SS -gone and missed


 
DonSSDD 
Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 7340
DonSSDD
Loc: Nova Scotia, Canada
Reg: 08-21-01
05-27-20 03:22 AM - Post#2794945    
    In response to ragtp66

American Autowire will modify the wiring harnesses they sell to suit whatever is being installed, ie. adding a later model alternator which has an internal regulator, hi torque starter, HEI or Pertronics. They did that for my 62 (since sold). Are you sure your alternator has an external regulator?

You could ask Donnie on the American Autowire Forum on here or their website to advise what harness you have, in case it is different from what you think it is or doesn

63 Pontiac Parisienne Sport Coupe(CDN Chev mechanically (409, 4 speed),62 Bel Air SC (sold), 59 El Camino (sold), 62 Bel Air SC(sold), 63 SWC Vette (sold),
Member #2194


Edited by DonSSDD on 05-27-20 03:24 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
kingkreeton 
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1423
kingkreeton
Loc: Houston TX
Reg: 04-15-11
05-27-20 04:37 AM - Post#2794948    
    In response to DonSSDD

I agree with Don, you are getting good advice from everyone here but we need to take a step back and verify whether your alternator is internal/external voltage regulator type and which wiring harness you are currently. I'm guessing its external from the look but please verify. Whoever installed your front light wiring harnesses did not do it correctly. There is no situation where you should not have a horn relay as it also acts as a (hot) junction block for your whole electrical system. Your front light harness should not be running on top of your radiator. You are asking for trouble by not having it tucked under the radiator support lip on the front of your car. It appears someone also put one of your horns where on the inside of your radiator support as opposed to the outside towards the front of the car. Your horn relay should be installed close to your voltage regulator but there is no room with that horn installed there. You have some serious wiring issues going on that need to be rectified prior to running your vehicle. I recommend disconnecting your battery until you get this installed correctly.

There are numerous sources for a 62 shop manual and 62 assembly manual. I recommend getting both while you are waiting on answers regarding your wiring harness and alternator.

You have an awesome looking car and need to get this taking car of correctly. I think your other posts about your headlights not working correctly are all tied into this same issue. We can help. I recommend starting a new topic regarding this issue so other users can benefit it by searching for a similar topic in the future.

Shane
64 Impala SS:
Chevy Performance 350HO
4 Speed Muncie

Proud member of Big Blue Nation, University of Kentucky Basketball. "Go Big Blue"


Edited by kingkreeton on 05-27-20 05:13 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
fander 
"4th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 184
fander
Loc: Hot Springs South Dakota
Reg: 04-28-12
05-27-20 08:09 AM - Post#2794972    
    In response to kingkreeton

Thanks. I do have the battery disconnected. The scary part was I drove it some last summer with that small green as the power source. I will move the wire and the horn. I am having to change quite a few things since getting the car back last summer but nothing too major. I am not complaining about the work I hired done since I am happy that I found a couple local fellows who agreed to put it back together from a pile of boxes from when I took it apart many years ago. It would have been nice if they would have paid more attention to the assembly manual and shop manual and supplement though. I am learning a lot about wiring which is kind of fun but I do miss not being able to drive it in this nice weather.



 
kingkreeton 
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1423
kingkreeton
Loc: Houston TX
Reg: 04-15-11
05-27-20 08:28 AM - Post#2794975    
    In response to fander

  • fander Said:
Thanks. I do have the battery disconnected. The scary part was I drove it some last summer with that small green as the power source. I will move the wire and the horn. I am having to change quite a few things since getting the car back last summer but nothing too major. I am not complaining about the work I hired done since I am happy that I found a couple local fellows who agreed to put it back together from a pile of boxes from when I took it apart many years ago. It would have been nice if they would have paid more attention to the assembly manual and shop manual and supplement though. I am learning a lot about wiring which is kind of fun but I do miss not being able to drive it in this nice weather.



I have always found that no shop is going to care about getting things correct as you will. Most won't open a manual, just slap things together and out the door for the next car.


Shane
64 Impala SS:
Chevy Performance 350HO
4 Speed Muncie

Proud member of Big Blue Nation, University of Kentucky Basketball. "Go Big Blue"


 
turbo38s10 
"9th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1802
turbo38s10
Loc: Agawam,MA
Reg: 09-17-09
05-27-20 12:49 PM - Post#2794995    
    In response to kingkreeton

Here is the 63 manual section with your wiring for the alt/reg. definitely looks like your missing the horn relay. Talk with american auto wire.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/e6y4bdp4z7oagvr/AA DzV7r...



 
fander 
"4th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 184
fander
Loc: Hot Springs South Dakota
Reg: 04-28-12
05-27-20 06:50 PM - Post#2795017    
    In response to kingkreeton

Moved the horns to the correct location. Thx. I took the wiring out from the top of the radiator and it was getting pinched. I want to verify the wire goes inside the top radiator support. How is it attached?



 
pvs409 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 2923
pvs409
Loc: Sergeant Bluff, Iowa
Reg: 01-10-05
05-27-20 07:23 PM - Post#2795022    
    In response to fander

There are original rubber covered push on clips to hold the wire to the radiator side of the the radiator support from the voltage regulator to the battery.
The radiator is pre drilled for these clips. I have plenty of them. There are about 4/5 holes on the back side of the upper support and 2 or 3 holes on the support about half way between the battery tray and the passenger side of fan shroud support to run the wire under the battery box to hook to positive side of the battery cable.

I can send pictures of were they mount and the clips( they have small tabs on the clips to fit in the small round factory drilled mounting holes In the radiator support).

Paul

57 BelairHT 283/270hp 4 spd
62 ImpHT 327/300 4 spd
62 Imp CV SS 327/300HP 700R4 (sold)
62 Imp HT SS 409/482 stroker 4 spd
62 Imp SS 409 - 5 spd Convertible
http://paulstensland.com


 




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