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Username Post: Vintage Chevy Club of America, horrible waste of money        (Topic#356452)
Keroppi 
Newbie
Posts: 48

Loc: NorCal
Reg: 10-24-18
05-16-19 10:12 PM - Post#2766585    

I never would have thought in a million years that joining a vintage car club would turn into such a lousy experience.

I am not exactly sure why, but the webmaster for the Vintage Chevy Club of America didn't like the posts I made and took it upon himself to censor and ban me from the VCCA Chat web site. The spineless person's name is (name removed), an associate webmaster that is pretty green around the ears...

The club turned out to be like a group of Grandmothers sitting around at a knitting club.

I will never pay another cent to the VCCA as long as I live.

If you're thinking about joining the VCCA, save your money and spend it on parts or another online forum, you will find that you get a lot more for your money that you will with VCCA.

And if you do join the VCCA, remember the VCCA mantra... "knit one, perl two..."



 
pauldian 
Contributor
Posts: 313
pauldian
Loc: seligman,arizona
Reg: 05-14-09
05-20-19 08:59 PM - Post#2766832    
    In response to Keroppi

( WOW )



 
2blu52 
"19th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 19263
2blu52
Age: 86
Loc: Montana
Reg: 03-12-02
05-26-19 10:33 AM - Post#2767115    
    In response to Keroppi

My experience after 16 years has been just the opposite. Yep they are old or at least very set in their ways, prefer you talk about stock rather than rodding, and much like this group prefer not to hear 4 letter words. They have knowledge that is unique due to age, interest and experience and over all I found them to be just as helpful and intersted as the CT group. An experience was over hub caps, my mechanic (me) did not have one set properly and lost it. I asked for some help in getting a hub cap that would match my remaining ones with 90,000 miles behind them, well I got two and for FREE! Cup is half full or half empty depends on where you are.

"PEACE IS THAT GLORIOUS MOMENT IN HISTORY WHEN EVERY ONE STANDS AROUND RELOADING"

THOMAS JEFFERSON


 
Ray P W 
Contributor
Posts: 504

Reg: 09-30-15
05-29-19 08:44 PM - Post#2767303    
    In response to 2blu52

Like the Stovebolt forum, the VCCA chat forum is dominated by a single individual who claims expertise in every issue that comes up. We all know that there is no way one person can know everything and on the few things I've researched in depth over the decades I've noticed that the "information" he gives out is often wrong.

He does serve a purpose, however, just like the guy on the Stovebolt forum. Some people don't want to do the work to research a subject of interest and find it easier to simply accept whatever an "Expert" says.

I've met the original poster, Alan, and like me he has a home machine shop and knows how to use it. That is in stark contrast to what I experienced in a 40+ year VCCA membership. With rare exceptions they farm out anything more challenging than sanding off rust and washing their vehicles.

People on the Chevytalk forum seem like grease under the nails motorheads.

To each his own, huh?

Ray W



Edited by Ray P W on 05-29-19 08:50 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
MTAZ 
Newbie
Posts: 28
MTAZ
Reg: 06-05-14
06-26-19 09:57 AM - Post#2769299    
    In response to Ray P W

I fully agree with the original post.

Have been a member of the VCCA for over 25 years & was one of the founding members when they started their website " VCCA chatter " in 2002.

Over the years the VCCA has made nothing but disastrous decisions on where they want the mission of the club to go.

The VCCA used to stand for the restoration & preservation of Original Chevy vehicles as they were made when they came off the assembly line.

The mission then changed to allow Non-Chevy vehicles into the club along with allowing hot rods & modified vehicles.

The club & website are no longer dedicated to the preservation & restoration of original Chevy vehicles.

The moderators, administrators & cronies of their website have deleted & banned themselves into obscurity.

If it was not for Gene answering all the technical questions on their website, it would be useless to most everyone, except for the small group of crony characters that like to banter with each other on the site about everything except classic vehicles.

All of the old Chevy truck guys that have the best technical knowledge have fled the VCCA chat for the greener pastures of the Stovebolt Page.

The VCCA has deteriorated & become obsolete & useless to me.
The ONLY reason I renew my subscription is to have access to the free parts ads in their monthly magazine which generates some income selling parts & it is tax deductible {and over the years...the quality of their magazine has gone into the crapper also}.

On top of all this they keep raising the annual dues while cutting services & eroding the quality of everything they do.

It says a lot when a long time member of a club will no longer recommend the club to anyone.





 
Ray P W 
Contributor
Posts: 504

Reg: 09-30-15
06-28-19 07:34 AM - Post#2769426    
    In response to MTAZ

"Have been a member of the VCCA for over 25 years & was one of the founding members when they started their website " VCCA chatter " in 2002."

MTAZ,

I was a member for over 40 years when I quit VCCA in 2009.

"If it was not for Gene answering all the technical questions on their website, it would be useless to most everyone, except for the small group of crony characters that like to banter with each other on the site about everything except classic vehicles."

To me that individual is part of the VCCA problem. He speaks with great authority and because of that gullible people think he knows everything. In reality, the body of knowledge in any field, even antique Chevrolets, is so large that no one person can know everything. What he has is a lot of parts books in which he can look up part numbers. That is like a telephone information operator looking up phone numbers. The real value that any "Expert" has on any forum is helping people figure out how to do challenging projects. That requires creative, outside the box thinking, not huge lists of part numbers and casting numbers.

An example of refusing to help with a member's project came up in early 2009 and was one of the "last straws" that ended my VCCA membership. A member wrote in to "Ask The Expert" in G & D asking how to set up an AC system with R134 refrigerant. That's a simple task easily accomplished with parts store products. I've done it myself, no sweat. "The Expert" told the person who inquired to take the vehicle to an AC shop. People don't join car/truck organizations to be told they can't do stuff. They know it can be done and they're inquiring how to do it.

My other VCCA "last straw" was also in 2009. VCCA was hemorrhaging members and put a member survey in the G & D to figure out why so many were quitting. I took the time to complete the survey and snail mail it in. After that the VCCA management refused to share the survey results with the general membership.

That was it for me. They got no more of my money.

The Stovebolt forum is similarly burdened with being dominated by a single individual who is credited with knowing everything and no presentation of information that contradicts their resident know-it-all is tolerated.

These forums work best when people feel free to ask questions without being ridiculed and when conflicting information can be presented and sorted out to find the truth. Chevytalk seems to be a very well functioning forum because a number of really knowledgeable people contribute and there are no "sacred cows".

An example of that occurred on Chevytalk recently in a discussion of DOT 5 brake fluid. There I learned that contrary to what I learned in high school and college physics, liquids actually ARE compressible to a very slight degree and that can affect brake systems. That's just one example of how an effective forum like this one spreads knowledge by encouraging wide participation and acknowledging that there is no single "Expert", no matter what the subject is.

Ray W



Edited by Ray P W on 06-28-19 07:36 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
MTAZ 
Newbie
Posts: 28
MTAZ
Reg: 06-05-14
07-04-19 08:56 AM - Post#2769920    
    In response to Ray P W

  • Ray P W Said:


"If it was not for Gene answering all the technical questions on their website, it would be useless to most everyone, except for the small group of crony characters that like to banter with each other on the site about everything except classic vehicles."

To me that individual is part of the VCCA problem. He speaks with great authority and because of that gullible people think he knows everything. In reality, the body of knowledge in any field, even antique Chevrolets, is so large that no one person can know everything. What he has is a lot of parts books in which he can look up part numbers. That is like a telephone information operator looking up phone numbers. The real value that any "Expert" has on any forum is helping people figure out how to do challenging projects. That requires creative, outside the box thinking, not huge lists of part numbers and casting numbers.



Ray W



I agree Ray.

Although somewhat knowledgeable about cars....
He provided incorrect technical information on a regular basis in the truck section of the site.

He became quite indignant every time anyone dared to correct him and he would get frustrated if you provided pictures & copies of GM literature that proved him to be wrong.
His usual response was to downplay his mistake & always had to have the last word {even if he was wrong}.
It became quite easy to run circles around him when he was wrong but, it was easier to make just one single post correcting him, rather than arguing back & forth with him for days.

The sad part is...people go to their site for technical information & the "big shot" of the site that hands out the most information is frequently incorrect with his answers, and everyone accepts his incorrect answers as gospel.






 
Ray P W 
Contributor
Posts: 504

Reg: 09-30-15
07-14-19 07:52 AM - Post#2770663    
    In response to MTAZ

Here from a Chevytalk forum member is a description of what happened when he tried to submit a technical article to VCCA:

02-10-09 03:57 PM - Post#1627136

"I have written a complete and detailed article on the rebuild of a 29-32 electrlock switch assy if anyone is interested. Tried to submit it to the G.D but was told it was too wordy. I describe the breakdown in childlike terms and details so it can be understood and is the way I would prefer to see it"

Nice, huh? People who just write checks to have work done aren't interested in actual information about how to do things.

His information is now on Chevytalk.

Ray W



 
RAM_51 
"4th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 5655
RAM_51
Loc: Yakima, WA. USA
Reg: 12-28-02
12-15-19 12:53 PM - Post#2782201    
    In response to MTAZ

  • MTAZ Said:
He provided incorrect technical information on a regular basis in the truck section of the site.


I struggled matching the paint that is on the top of the dash and window garnish moldings of my 1950 DeLuxe Chevrolet. Fortunately, I was working in the auto body trade at the time and had access to a full mixing bank of Sikkens tints etc. I looked through all of the associated color mapping books and was not satisfied with any chip that I saw there as a starting point for mixing this color. It wasn't until we got in a 1993 Honda in Eucalyptus Green that I realized that that color was the perfect starting point. Long story short, I mixed an extremely close match starting with that Honda color. Eventually, I had the opportunity to share that discovery in the 1949-54 chatroom. What "frosted my mug" was "someone" taking that information and re-sharing it, without giving credit where, or from whom, they had acquired it; almost as if it was from their personal knowledge or experience. Basically building upon their GURU status by using other people's knowledge or discoveries. It was like I was "chopped liver"...I didn't deserve credit for my knowledge. NOT KOOL!

I too was an "on and off" member at VCCA, and I too, was most interested in the classified section of the club's monthly publication. To be honest though, once the internet took hold and eBay came into being, the classifieds didn't hold my attention or interest as they once had.


1951 Fleetline Preservation
'51 Fleetline DeLuxe 2 DOOR SEDAN (Fathom Green)
'51 Styleline Special BUSINESS COUPE (Shadow Gray)
'53 6500 Dump Bed (Oxidized Red)
'50 Styleline DeLuxe 4 DOOR SEDAN (Mist Green)


 
Ray P W 
Contributor
Posts: 504

Reg: 09-30-15
04-29-20 09:24 PM - Post#2792402    
    In response to MTAZ

"The sad part is...people go to their site for technical information & the "big shot" of the site that hands out the most information is frequently incorrect with his answers, and everyone accepts his incorrect answers as gospel."

MTAZ,

Have you ever looked at the Stovebolt forums (https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthreads/) ?

That forum has an identical situation except the "big shot" on that forum goes beyond dispensing often incorrect information*. He takes it upon himself to personally ridicule anyone who points out credible contradictory information, for example information from respected automotive enthusiast magazines.

* Just a couple of examples of his obviously wrong pronouncements are:

1. Exhaust balance tubes (H & X pipes) are "Rube Goldberg contraptions that don't work".

2. All front wheel bearings on rear wheel drive cars/trucks have to be torqued to preload them just like differential pinion and carrier bearings.

3. The GM 200 4R transmission has no potential for use in a performance vehicle because it is inherently weak and cannot be upgraded for high performance applications.

There are countless others of his absurd assertions on the Stovebolt forums.

The November 18, 1978 Jonestown mass suicide shows that there is no shortage of blindly loyal true believers who will enthusiastically leap off a cliff if the "big shot" tells them to.

Oh well, that's their choice.

Ray W



 
BigDogSS 
"11th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 4786
BigDogSS
Loc: SoCal
Reg: 12-21-01
04-30-20 10:01 AM - Post#2792430    
    In response to Keroppi

There is much more to VCCA than just the chat forum. I joined a local region and have been going on tours, going to car shows, monthly meetings, etc. Our region even hosts our own car show. Lots of great people I've met.
While I don't agree with everything about VCCA, there is enough there to keep me.


    1967 Chevrolet Impala SS convertible 327 - Ermine White C1 - VCCA Senior Award
    1967 Chevrolet Impala SS Sport Coupe 396 - Marina Blue FF - personal "barn-find" lol



Edited by BigDogSS on 04-30-20 10:05 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
Ray P W 
Contributor
Posts: 504

Reg: 09-30-15
04-30-20 11:31 AM - Post#2792433    
    In response to BigDogSS

Good morning Big Dog

Where in So Cal are you? I lived in Glendale for 27 years and tried different Regions, including Foothill (I was the first "Director" of that Region) and San Fernando Valley.

My vintage Chevy is a '36 PU that I restored myself with my own 2 hands except the glass cutting, chrome plating, engine cylinder boring and engine bearing pouring. I was hoping to meet others with that approach to the antique car hobby but simply didn't find that in VCCA as time went on. To put my approach to the car hobby in perspective, I finished my restoration just in time for the 1976 VCCA National Meet in Colorado Springs. Believing that vehicles are for driving, not for hauling around in/on trailers, my wife and I drove from Glendale to Colorado Springs, a distance of about 1400 miles, camping all the way (no motels or restaurants). In those days show judges apparently also agreed that vehicles are for driving because they judged my home restored pickup with bug juice all over the windshield first in Class T-2 (1929-36 commercial vehicles).

That was the VCCA culture 45 years ago, a group of do-it-yourselfers. Now VCCA seems dedicated to a different demographic, "collectors" with no actual restoration skills who have discovered old cars as a safe place to park their money. That makes VCCA irrelevant to old school guys like me. My idea of enjoying the antique car hobby is doing projects like this:

https://vccachat.org/ubbthreads.php/topics/334876/...

Obviously that is not an example mainstream VCCA activity anymore.

Ray W



 
Ray P W 
Contributor
Posts: 504

Reg: 09-30-15
05-05-20 09:17 AM - Post#2792835    
    In response to MTAZ

MTAZ and Big Dog,

My wife has a saying that I think applies here "There is a lid for every pot".

In this case comparing VCCA members and Chevytalk forum members is like comparing people who buy crate engines to people who build their own engines.

The priority for crate engine buyers is not having to get their hands dirty and not having to do the research to pick parts that will work well together. They say "How bad can it be? It has a warranty." What I think, but don't say, in response to that is "The cheapest machining and parts, assembled carelessly is how bad it can be, like using a $20 timing set instead of a $120 true roller timing set and plain cast pistons instead of hypereutectic pistons and not honing with a torque plate installed."

The priority for people who build their own engines is picking the parts combination that is best for its intended purpose, knowing those parts are assembled correctly and being able to take pride in what they accomplished.

One group takes pride in what they own and the other group takes pride in what they actually did.

Ray W



Edited by Tony on 05-07-20 03:18 PM. Reason for edit: Discussion Halted . Involved parties know why.

 
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