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Username Post: Water Pump & Pully Problem        (Topic#349956)
junky 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 2662

Loc: Northeast CT
Reg: 06-27-10
03-05-18 05:28 PM - Post#2726552    

I installed a rebuilt water pump on my 1962 327 / 300 HP engine, and when I attempted to install the pulley and fan, I ran into a problem. The shaft is too large for the original pulley and fan clutch. I thought that it might just be a fluke that the re-builder used the wrong size shaft, so I dug out a new rebuild kit that I had bought. Checked the shaft on that one, and it is the same as the rebuilt water pump. The water pump that was on the engine has a smaller diameter shaft, and is the later style that has the plug in the middle of the top for a heater hose. After checking a few other water pumps in my collection of used parts, I have come to the conclusion that the pulley and fan clutch are wrong for a 1962.
What is the diameter of the fan pulley for a 1962 327/300 HP engine with air conditioning? I could bore out the pulley that I have to a larger diameter, but I don't know if the diameter of the correct pulley is the same as what I have. I will purchase a new fan clutch to complete the project. I am thinking that this is the reason that I had a problem installing the air conditioning belt a few years ago.
thanks.. Junk

Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level, then beat you with experience.


 




pvs409 
"6th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 2226
pvs409
Loc: Sergeant Bluff, Iowa
Reg: 01-10-05
03-05-18 06:39 PM - Post#2726555    
    In response to junky

Here are the correct 62 and 61 factory air pulleys for small V-8's.
Paul

Attachment: IMG_0461.JPG (104.67 KB) 7 View(s)


Dual upper one piece pulley and 2 piece lower triple pulley


57 BelairHT 283/270hp 4 spd
62 ImpHT 327/300 4 spd
62 Imp CV SS 327/300HP 700R4
62 ImpHT SS 409/482 stroker 4 spd
62 Imp SS 409 - 5 spd Convertible under frameoff
Web http://paulstensland.com/


 
junky 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 2662

Loc: Northeast CT
Reg: 06-27-10
03-05-18 07:51 PM - Post#2726576    
    In response to pvs409

My lower pulleys are correct. The water pump pulley that is on the car is 6 7/8" diameter with a smaller center hole. The pulley that I need is 5 3/4" diameter, with the larger center hole. The 2 groove pulley is for the air conditioning. At this point, I have to get the car running, so I am headed to the local junk yard that has a 1962 6 cylinder car in there. I will get the pulley from that car, and the 4 blade fan, to get my car running. Over the next few weeks, I hope that I can find the correct parts at Spring Carlisle.

Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level, then beat you with experience.


 
pvs409 
"6th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 2226
pvs409
Loc: Sergeant Bluff, Iowa
Reg: 01-10-05
03-05-18 08:16 PM - Post#2726581    
    In response to junky

Here is a original factory 327 and 409 5 bladed fan and a group of used fan clutches.
Paul


Attachment: IMG_0077.JPG (154.7 KB) 7 View(s)


factory 5 bladed fan for 250 and 300 HP 327's and all 409's in 1962 and 1963 and 1964. Used fan clutches for various years of Chevrolet's


57 BelairHT 283/270hp 4 spd
62 ImpHT 327/300 4 spd
62 Imp CV SS 327/300HP 700R4
62 ImpHT SS 409/482 stroker 4 spd
62 Imp SS 409 - 5 spd Convertible under frameoff
Web http://paulstensland.com/


 
Carl1962 
"6th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1281
Carl1962
Loc: Bungendore Australia
Reg: 04-01-10
03-05-18 11:12 PM - Post#2726608    
    In response to pvs409

The top pulley for my 62 250hp 327 with factory air (build date 2nd week May) is 5 3/4".

Cheers, Carl.

1962 SS Impala Sports Coupe

http://s465.photobucket.com/albums/rr18/1956Carlo s...


 
Andy4639 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 1147

Age: 58
Loc: Liberty, SC
Reg: 08-06-16
03-06-18 04:36 AM - Post#2726614    
    In response to Carl1962

That looks just like mine I pulled off a 62 in the local yard last summer for mine. man that thing pulls some air. I put a new Heavy duty clutch on it though.




1956 Bel Air - LT-1/4l60
1964 SS Impala -350 crate/powerglide
1967 Ramp truck - 350/ 4 speed
1971 C 10 - 6.0 LS / 4l80e 4:10 gears 30 years owner
94 Elderado
2000 S-10
2008 LTZ Tahoe
2011 Treverse


 
junky 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 2662

Loc: Northeast CT
Reg: 06-27-10
03-06-18 10:36 AM - Post#2726653    
    In response to junky

I am back to square one on this. The yard said that the 1962 was crushed a few months ago, so I am still in need of finding the correct water pump pulley. Searching all my parts books, I have determined that the correct part number is 3840463 and that it is a 5 3/4" diameter pulley with 2 grooves. If anyone has one to sell, please send me a PM. thansk Junk

Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level, then beat you with experience.


 
Andy4639 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 1147

Age: 58
Loc: Liberty, SC
Reg: 08-06-16
03-06-18 11:13 AM - Post#2726658    
    In response to junky

  • junky Said:
I am back to square one on this. The yard said that the 1962 was crushed a few months ago, so I am still in need of finding the correct water pump pulley. Searching all my parts books, I have determined that the correct part number is 3840463 and that it is a 5 3/4" diameter pulley with 2 grooves. If anyone has one to sell, please send me a PM. thansk Junk




I don't know if it's the same part number but a 71 C10 small block with factory air has the double pulley.
They may have one in the yard.




1956 Bel Air - LT-1/4l60
1964 SS Impala -350 crate/powerglide
1967 Ramp truck - 350/ 4 speed
1971 C 10 - 6.0 LS / 4l80e 4:10 gears 30 years owner
94 Elderado
2000 S-10
2008 LTZ Tahoe
2011 Treverse


 
junky 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 2662

Loc: Northeast CT
Reg: 06-27-10
03-06-18 12:42 PM - Post#2726668    
    In response to Andy4639

That is a larger diameter pulley. The research that I have done, indicates when the alternator moves from the left (drivers) side, to the right (passenger)side, the diameter of the pully became larger. This is why the 1963 and up pulleys won't work. Thanks for the suggestion.

Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level, then beat you with experience.


 
pvs409 
"6th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 2226
pvs409
Loc: Sergeant Bluff, Iowa
Reg: 01-10-05
03-06-18 06:17 PM - Post#2726689    
    In response to junky

  • junky Said:
I am back to square one on this. The yard said that the 1962 was crushed a few months ago, so I am still in need of finding the correct water pump pulley. Searching all my parts books, I have determined that the correct part number is 3840463 and that it is a 5 3/4" diameter pulley with 2 grooves. If anyone has one to sell, please send me a PM. thansk Junk



Junk
I thought I sent you a private message on the 62 factory air upper dual groove pulley but I did not I have one and will send a response to you.

Its 5 3/4 inches or 5 7/8 ( I have 2 of them plus 2 on my 62 factory air cars.
Paul


Attachment: IMG_0463.JPG (91.28 KB) 8 View(s)


62 factory air upper pulley


Attachment: IMG_0464.JPG (97.84 KB) 4 View(s)


62 Chevy upper A/C pulley back side


57 BelairHT 283/270hp 4 spd
62 ImpHT 327/300 4 spd
62 Imp CV SS 327/300HP 700R4
62 ImpHT SS 409/482 stroker 4 spd
62 Imp SS 409 - 5 spd Convertible under frameoff
Web http://paulstensland.com/


 
junky 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 2662

Loc: Northeast CT
Reg: 06-27-10
03-06-18 07:58 PM - Post#2726698    
    In response to pvs409

I have found 3 differing diameter measurements in various book for the same part number. I believe that it is a matter of production variances, since the differences are extremely small.

Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level, then beat you with experience.


 
Andy4639 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 1147

Age: 58
Loc: Liberty, SC
Reg: 08-06-16
03-07-18 05:09 AM - Post#2726719    
    In response to junky

Don't know if this is right are not but it states it will work on a 62 Impala with 327 engine.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/263467841044?rmvS B=true



You may want to look here also.
https://picclick.com/?q=64+impala+water+pu mp+pulle...


1956 Bel Air - LT-1/4l60
1964 SS Impala -350 crate/powerglide
1967 Ramp truck - 350/ 4 speed
1971 C 10 - 6.0 LS / 4l80e 4:10 gears 30 years owner
94 Elderado
2000 S-10
2008 LTZ Tahoe
2011 Treverse


Edited by Andy4639 on 03-07-18 05:11 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
junky 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 2662

Loc: Northeast CT
Reg: 06-27-10
03-07-18 12:53 PM - Post#2726757    
    In response to Andy4639

Thanks for the link. Unfortunately, that water pump pulley is "Black 2 Groove Water Pump Pulley. This Water pump pulley is 6.40" diameter", which is much too large for the air condition application. Thanks to PVS409, I have one coming by USPS.

Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level, then beat you with experience.


 
omarine 
Contributor
Posts: 172

Loc: San Diego
Reg: 06-29-15
07-13-18 09:42 AM - Post#2739848    
    In response to junky

After leaving socal, with newly installed AC, ive learned that i too lack enough fan power. Its the stock 4 blade with almost 7” pulley.

My question is, if i use 18” 6 blade fan and 5-3/4” pulley as stated above, will it impove my air flow enough? Car gets hot only while idling or slow traffic.

Everyone is quick to recommend electric fans but if there is a more original way then Id prefer that. Then maybe PVS409 would have another pulley too if ii were in luck.

Thanks!

61 Impala bubbletop, 283, 2bbl Rochester, generator, points and drum brakes- daily driver
'49 Harley Davidson FL - Panhead


Edited by omarine on 07-13-18 09:45 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
pvs409 
"6th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 2226
pvs409
Loc: Sergeant Bluff, Iowa
Reg: 01-10-05
07-13-18 12:27 PM - Post#2739873    
    In response to omarine

I have stated before on this forum so I will state it again.
I have 2 - 1962 Chevy's with 327 motors and factory air on both of them. My 62 hardtop is 4 speed - 300HP/327 speed the other 62 SS convertible is a 300HP/327 with a 700R4 overdrive transmission.

Both of these cars have 4 core 409 style radiators. The 4 speed car has a new brass 4 core installed 409 radiator top and frames. The convert has a reproduction 4 core 409 radiator purchased from Show Cars. Both cars have had these radiators for 14 + years with factory fan shrouds plus factory 5 bladed fans, factory original A/C pulleys(like the pictures I posted above) and new fan clutches.

These cars run at 180/185 degrees all day long. Both cars have been driven multiple times through Back to the Fifties parade loop at 2 mph or less and will not overheat.
The red 4 speed Hardtop just drove around this loop again 2 weeks ago -it takes over a hour "to drive less than 10 blocks with lots of stopping" -since their are so many cars and people sitting along the loop. The red hardtop got to 195 degrees twice and never overheated. I do not need electric fans.

My point is my factory cooling setup with the 4 core radiators works. I added the 4 core radiators to the original cooling items I listed "just for drives like the Back to the Fifies "parade tour on the St Paul fairgrounds" and also for slow traffic..( 11,800+ cars at Back to the Fifties this year)

Paul

57 BelairHT 283/270hp 4 spd
62 ImpHT 327/300 4 spd
62 Imp CV SS 327/300HP 700R4
62 ImpHT SS 409/482 stroker 4 spd
62 Imp SS 409 - 5 spd Convertible under frameoff
Web http://paulstensland.com/


 
omarine 
Contributor
Posts: 172

Loc: San Diego
Reg: 06-29-15
07-13-18 02:19 PM - Post#2739882    
    In response to pvs409

Thanks Paul, i apprciate the info. I need to upgrade my fan set up to the factory AC specs. I already have the aluminum radiator, except mine is 2 row i think. I will begin with the fan since its currently incorrect anyway.

The 4 core would be the final step if needed. My current radiator has workd great until installing the AC recently.

Do you have another 5-3/4" doubble groove water pump pulley that you won't be using?

Thanks again,
Oscar

61 Impala bubbletop, 283, 2bbl Rochester, generator, points and drum brakes- daily driver
'49 Harley Davidson FL - Panhead


 
dgstarr 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 83
dgstarr
Loc: Portland, OR
Reg: 04-16-13
07-13-18 02:56 PM - Post#2739892    
    In response to pvs409

I wish I had read Paul's experiences with radiators before I ordered a US Radiator 409, 4 row, high efficiency radiator for my 62 327, 300hp, factory A/C car. The car went to 240 degrees in 90 degree slow heavy traffic. The stock 3 row, big tank radiator never went over 220 degrees in similar conditions. Adding a Hayden 2947 HD fan clutch and a 6 blade fan has lowered the temperature, but it is noisy at highway speeds. The 4 row HE radiator requires just to much air flow. I may put my original radiator back in and live with it, because it is not over 90 degrees very often where I live in NW Oregon.



 
omarine 
Contributor
Posts: 172

Loc: San Diego
Reg: 06-29-15
07-13-18 06:33 PM - Post#2739910    
    In response to dgstarr

Thats one of the several reasons i need to make original set up work. Electric must be nice, but last resort for me.

61 Impala bubbletop, 283, 2bbl Rochester, generator, points and drum brakes- daily driver
'49 Harley Davidson FL - Panhead


 
Mercedes 
Contributor
Posts: 189

Reg: 07-09-18
07-14-18 08:51 AM - Post#2739956    
    In response to omarine

I'm surprised that you are having this much trouble with the water pump, etc. Back many years ago, I had a 62 and a 64, both with small block engines. I sourced water pumps that didn't have the blocked off fitting at the top and from what I remember, never had an issue with the pulley fitting.

As far as overheating and airflow, you need to be sure that all of the airflow is going across the radiator not around it. If you look at the fan shroud, fill the air gaps along the perimeter with some type of material that looks OEM. I ended up using some black vinyl walkway material that looked factory and wasn't noticeable and did the job.



 
omarine 
Contributor
Posts: 172

Loc: San Diego
Reg: 06-29-15
07-14-18 07:20 PM - Post#2739993    
    In response to Mercedes

Mercedes, i know what you mean and plan to do that as well around the shroud.

I am not having any water pump issues, it's fairly new. What i am trying to do is find the correct sized 5-3/4" or 5-7/8" pulley that was used with factory AC in 61-62. I did not have a condenser in front of my radiator until a few weeks ago and my 4 blade fan with 7" pulley with shroud gaps are causing rising temps while idling, now that ive moved to FL, which were never an issue in socal.

Cheers



61 Impala bubbletop, 283, 2bbl Rochester, generator, points and drum brakes- daily driver
'49 Harley Davidson FL - Panhead


 
Mercedes 
Contributor
Posts: 189

Reg: 07-09-18
07-15-18 07:31 AM - Post#2740026    
    In response to omarine

I would recommend upgrading to a 7-blade fan with a thermal clutch, as well.



 
Andy4639 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 1147

Age: 58
Loc: Liberty, SC
Reg: 08-06-16
07-17-18 06:53 PM - Post#2740351    
    In response to omarine

The factory AC cars should have the 6 blade with the clutch. If you add AC you need to upgrade the fan blade it want ever keep it cool in the heat of the day.



1956 Bel Air - LT-1/4l60
1964 SS Impala -350 crate/powerglide
1967 Ramp truck - 350/ 4 speed
1971 C 10 - 6.0 LS / 4l80e 4:10 gears 30 years owner
94 Elderado
2000 S-10
2008 LTZ Tahoe
2011 Treverse


 
Verne_Frantz 
61-64 Subject Matter Expert
Posts: 5433
Verne_Frantz
Loc: Hightstown,NJ USA
Reg: 08-22-00
07-17-18 07:57 PM - Post#2740360    
    In response to Andy4639

  • Andy4639 Said:
The factory AC cars should have the 6 blade with the clutch. If you add AC you need to upgrade the fan blade it want ever keep it cool in the heat of the day.




NONE of those cars ever came with a 6 blade fan!!!!!!!!!!

Verne



 
omarine 
Contributor
Posts: 172

Loc: San Diego
Reg: 06-29-15
07-17-18 08:05 PM - Post#2740361    
    In response to Verne_Frantz

Well. After purchasing 6" pulley and 5 blade original fan with clutch, i only managed to slow down the temp climb.

Tonight 20 m of idling got the temp over 212. Bummed.

I am running a genny and dont want to have to upgrade.

And i didnt want to cave in and buy an electric fan but it may be better than buying another radiator considering that cruising it does its job well.

Prefer to run if off of thermostat as a back up to the mech fan.

Thinking about pull SPAL fan hidden in the shroud.

Any comments or suggestions welcome for moving forward.

Is that threaded plug on top of water pump for a thermostat switch? Looks like 1" threads.

Thanks.

61 Impala bubbletop, 283, 2bbl Rochester, generator, points and drum brakes- daily driver
'49 Harley Davidson FL - Panhead


 
dgstarr 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 83
dgstarr
Loc: Portland, OR
Reg: 04-16-13
07-17-18 08:46 PM - Post#2740363    
    In response to Verne_Frantz

Verne, as he normally is, is correct, Chevrolet never used, to my knowledge, 6 blade fans. The correct fan with a clutch has 5 blades. The late 64 and 65 Corvette with A/C has a 7 blade fan pn: 5853943. The 68 Corvette with A/C has a 7 blade fan pn: 3931002. These fans are 18 in. in diameter and will work with a 59-64 Full size car with the stock fan clutch. Starting in 1969 or 1970 they went to the long water pumps and used a different fan clutch and fan mounting pattern.

Dave



 




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