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Username Post: I've got a TPI issue NO START        (Topic#236995)
Dru71 
Member
Posts: 60
Dru71
Reg: 09-09-04
03-04-10 06:14 PM - Post#1874034    

So I picked up an 88 T/A that was ran hard and put up wet to say it as nice as I could. It would run at first with a spray of fuel to the throttle body, fair enough no fuel.

Put a new bosch fuel pump and sending unit in (good job on that design GM) started right up
ran it to the gas station and filled her up
by the time I got back 2 miles, i noticed it was running warmer than it should, didn't get it to hot.

I havent got a chance to fix the coolant flow issue yet, but it still started and moved around my property.

So I backed it into its spot a few months ago, and then lately went to start it, no love

I can still hear the fuel pump working
I am getting spark
I have fuel at the rail
no start
so I figured maybe a fuel problem somehow,
no, sprayed some in the intake, no love

Nice strong yellow top for a battery, so voltage shouldnt be a problem it cranks fine

It seems to me it has all it needs, fuel, air, spark, and starter.

I don't think it jumped time at all, I have not compression tested it yet, but it still sounds.....right

I am leaning twords an electrical maybe ECU issue

Any help or info????

Thanks all



Edited by Dru71 on 03-04-10 06:20 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 




Vice04 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 49

Loc: KS
Reg: 06-24-09
03-04-10 09:46 PM - Post#1874112    
    In response to Dru71

I'd say to get one of those tester things for the injectors (can't remember the name of them) My best guess is there at the injectors. Could be a wire issue between them and the ECU, or the ECU itself. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the early TPI a batch fire? So all the injectors spray at once?

Some other things to consider:
Fuel pressure, how much? you need to be around 40 PSI
Fuel Filter, could be restricting pressure
Fuel Pressure Regulator, see if it's aftermarket, it might be out of whack


I'm leaning more towards a fuel issue than spark (no pun intended lol)

But it couldn't hurt to check your plugs, wires, cap, and rotor, even timing

It's gotta start on No. 1 or it won't run, so make sure everything is good there.

It's hard to diagnose something not in front of me, so I can only tell you what I would do, check the electrical part first just to be safe. Even if it's just looking under the cap and pulling No. 1 plug. Then if still no go, replace the fuel filter. They are cheap and easy anyway. Then move on to the injectors and see if they are getting power.

Hope this helps



 
Dru71 
Member
Posts: 60
Dru71
Reg: 09-09-04
03-04-10 11:35 PM - Post#1874120    
    In response to Vice04

I do appreciate the advice, but before the prior fuel issue I could spray some in the throttle body and it would at least cough for me, but now I try the same thing and nothing.

My thoughts on that is that the complete fuel system is pretty much eliminated.

I only had a short time to mess with it as I am away from the car now for another 2 weeks. The only thing related to fuel I could think of is maybe it was flooded, but since the pump replacement it has always fired right up



 
Randy_W 
None
Posts: 27804

Reg: 01-06-02
03-05-10 04:27 AM - Post#1874139    
    In response to Dru71

Get a noid and see if the injectors are firing, if not I would check crank, cam sensors and the map sensor.
If the Formula runs o.k., grab the map sensor off it to try. If that doesn't do it I'd go to the crank sensor, etc...
If you verify fuel from the injectors by seeing gas in the chamber and the plugs are actually visibly firing, you have a timing issue. I doubt that's it, but I once pulled in the yard with a perfectly running 400 Firebird and turned it off. Wouldn't start next day, found a broken timing gear.

Randy

DON'T mess with Old Men, we didn't get old by being, STUPID!!!

"The veneer of civilization is very thin!" (Arlo)


 
Vice04 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 49

Loc: KS
Reg: 06-24-09
03-05-10 10:17 AM - Post#1874323    
    In response to Randy_W

That's what it was, a noid light! Thank you, was trying to think of that all night.



 
Dru71 
Member
Posts: 60
Dru71
Reg: 09-09-04
03-05-10 04:42 PM - Post#1874537    
    In response to Randy_W

  • Randy_W Said:
Get a noid and see if the injectors are firing, if not I would check crank, cam sensors and the map sensor.
If the Formula runs o.k., grab the map sensor off it to try. If that doesn't do it I'd go to the crank sensor, etc...
If you verify fuel from the injectors by seeing gas in the chamber and the plugs are actually visibly firing, you have a timing issue. I doubt that's it, but I once pulled in the yard with a perfectly running 400 Firebird and turned it off. Wouldn't start next day, found a broken timing gear.



Do TBI cars share sensors with TPI cars?

I hear that on those old 389's and 400's, my 67 Catalina has that same problem right now with its 400



 
Randy_W 
None
Posts: 27804

Reg: 01-06-02
03-05-10 06:08 PM - Post#1874585    
    In response to Dru71

Most sensors are different, didn't think to ask which engine it had.

Randy

DON'T mess with Old Men, we didn't get old by being, STUPID!!!

"The veneer of civilization is very thin!" (Arlo)


 
paulo57509 
Senior Member
Posts: 398

Loc: Tracy, CA
Reg: 07-18-00
03-05-10 11:11 PM - Post#1874726    
    In response to Randy_W

What year did VATS (anti-theft system) start to show up in F-Bodies?

Seems like there are a LOT of no-start issues if one reads the posts on thirdgen.org.

Not saying your problem is VATS related.

http://www.thirdgen.org/

1987 IROC-Z 5.0L
1992 Lumina Euro 3.1L
2003 GMC Safari


Edited by paulo57509 on 03-05-10 11:11 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
Randy_W 
None
Posts: 27804

Reg: 01-06-02
03-06-10 09:21 AM - Post#1874880    
    In response to paulo57509

I believe '89 was first vats, not certain though.

Randy

DON'T mess with Old Men, we didn't get old by being, STUPID!!!

"The veneer of civilization is very thin!" (Arlo)


 
george88gta 
"16th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1988
george88gta
Loc: new york
Reg: 04-23-03
03-06-10 01:42 PM - Post#1875004    
    In response to Randy_W

  • Randy_W Said:
I believe '89 was first vats, not certain though.


Actually, I have VATS on my 1988. Not sure if it started before, but I doubt it.



 
Dru71 
Member
Posts: 60
Dru71
Reg: 09-09-04
03-06-10 02:40 PM - Post#1875042    
    In response to george88gta

Dont think its vats, no security light and it cranks fine

And as for VATS I believe it was introduced on the 85 vettes



Edited by Dru71 on 03-06-10 02:45 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
george88gta 
"16th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1988
george88gta
Loc: new york
Reg: 04-23-03
03-06-10 03:13 PM - Post#1875053    
    In response to Dru71

  • Dru71 Said:
Dont think its vats, no security light and it cranks fine

And as for VATS I believe it was introduced on the 85 vettes


I am not sure exactly how VATS works ( e.g cranks but wont start or wont crank) but the question I answered was when did VATS start on F bodies and I couldnt find a Firebird reference earlier than 1988. No idea as to Y bodies implementation.



 
YeniPenny 
Dedicated Enthusiast
Posts: 5968
YeniPenny
Loc: Biloxi, Ms
Reg: 11-26-01
03-06-10 04:13 PM - Post#1875103    
    In response to george88gta

  • george88gta Said:
  • Dru71 Said:
Dont think its vats, no security light and it cranks fine

And as for VATS I believe it was introduced on the 85 vettes


I am not sure exactly how VATS works ( e.g cranks but wont start or wont crank) but the question I answered was when did VATS start on F bodies and I couldnt find a Firebird reference earlier than 1988. No idea as to Y bodies implementation.



88 is correct for F bodies. It was 1986 for Y bodies.



 
Toqwik 
Contributor
Posts: 289
Toqwik
Loc: Middleburg, FL
Reg: 05-14-17
12-25-17 07:05 PM - Post#2719004    
    In response to YeniPenny

Mine on occasion has VATS issues. Car will not turn over when it is activated so I do not think that is the issue. I would go after spark. If you have spark and spray it with ether and it doesn't cough, you have a spark issue. Pull your plugs and see what they tell you. First thing I would chase is the module in the bottom of the distributor.

Contentment is the smother of invention


 




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