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Username Post: heat        (Topic#365308)
Airlifter 
"6th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 813
Airlifter
Age: 76
Loc: Tazewell county, Virginia
Reg: 06-07-15
05-24-21 05:11 AM - Post#2820454    

Took a little trip this weekend. About 280 miles. The temperature ranged form 80 to 90 degrees. The car ran fine except that it got really hot on the long upgrades and in stop and go traffic. It never got to the point of overheating but the needle was pegged. There was some misfiring or hesitation. I am running a 4psi cap and I never lost any coolant so I don't think the heat ever got critical. I have had the radiator recored and a new water pump. I kept the speed around 60-65 and the rpm at around 2600-3000.

I have also noticed that on hot days if I stop for a few minutes with the engine off the car will hesitate after starting backup and driving a few feet.

Looking for suggestions and/or ideas.

Thanks, Pete


1951 styline deluxe sport coupe w/'60 261 engine & 54 powerglide


 


rrausch 
"16th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 14671
rrausch
Loc: L.A, Cal. & St. Louis...
Reg: 04-07-03
05-24-21 05:28 AM - Post#2820456    
    In response to Airlifter

It could be the problem is the needle has been bent toward the HOT side of the gauge. I'd check the temps with a infrared thermometer. I had the same problem with the amp gauge--needle reading dis-charge, when in fact the system was charging nicely. I bent the needle and that fixed the "problem".

1953 210 Convertible, 261 with dual Carter YF 966S carbs, P.S., Remote Bendix P.B. Booster... shade-tree restoration about done.




 
drtyler 
"7th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 621
drtyler
Loc: Georgia
Reg: 05-06-10
05-24-21 05:45 AM - Post#2820458    
    In response to rrausch

How’s the timing?



 
Airlifter 
"6th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 813
Airlifter
Age: 76
Loc: Tazewell county, Virginia
Reg: 06-07-15
05-24-21 05:56 AM - Post#2820459    
    In response to drtyler

Rausch, I think is going to get an after market gauge to check accuracy of stock gauge.

Drtyler, the timing was 12 degrees. I had adjusted with vacuum gauge. I backed off to 6 degrees this morning to see if that makes any difference.

Thanks, Pete

1951 styline deluxe sport coupe w/'60 261 engine & 54 powerglide


 
drtyler 
"7th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 621
drtyler
Loc: Georgia
Reg: 05-06-10
05-24-21 06:12 AM - Post#2820460    
    In response to Airlifter

Hopefully it will be simple. The last time mine was running too warm was due to some combo of timing and loose fan belt. I corrected both at the same time.





Edited by drtyler on 05-24-21 06:12 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
Airlifter 
"6th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 813
Airlifter
Age: 76
Loc: Tazewell county, Virginia
Reg: 06-07-15
05-24-21 12:50 PM - Post#2820476    
    In response to drtyler

I considered an auxiliary fan but at 60 mph there should be plenty of airflow through the radiator.

1951 styline deluxe sport coupe w/'60 261 engine & 54 powerglide


 
wagonman100 
Site Ambassador
Posts: 15355

Loc: Baltimore, MD
Reg: 11-27-04
05-24-21 06:39 PM - Post#2820506    
    In response to Airlifter

Do you have a fan shroud? The fan will pull more air with a proper shroud. If you can seal the area around the radiator it will help direct the air through the radiator and improve cooling.

Jay
Friends don’t let friends drive Fords.

1999 Silverado Z71 4X4 extra-cab short bed
1983 Malibu Fauxmad - tubbed
1978 El Camino Kustomized
1972 Monte Carlo
1957 210 handyman wagon
1957 Nomad sport wagon
1957 Cameo Carrier


 
johnwd98 
Contributor
Posts: 577
johnwd98
Age: 72
Loc: Little Falls, MN
Reg: 09-05-10
05-25-21 04:58 AM - Post#2820518    
    In response to Airlifter

After checking your temp gauge for accuracy, I would make sure there is a good seal between the radiator support, and top of radiator to the hood. Under the right conditions your fan can suck air over the top of the radiator rather than through it. How far from the radiator is your fan? Also, through my own experience with a V8 in my car, and since you have a larger transplant engine, I would consider a cool air intake system to your air cleaner, so you're not sucking hot under hood air into the carb. Making sure these conditions are met, might be easier than adapting a fan shroud to your car, which won't help much if the easiest route for cool air is over the top of your radiator, by the way I don't have a fan shroud.

1950 Fleetline, 355 TBI, mild cam, 700R4, 3.73 posi rear Blazer axle, MII front. P/W, Remote door and trunk locks, GM cruise control, A/C.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/54237519@N00/a lbums


 
Dean50 
"15th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 1753
Dean50
Loc: Detroit area
Reg: 01-02-07
05-26-21 08:35 AM - Post#2820568    
    In response to Airlifter

Last summer the '50 started overheating. Chased the problem for awhile. Problem was a blocked radiator, even though the coolant was running in the top and out the bottom. When I finally pulled the " empty" radiator it weighed a ton, still half full of coolant that wouldn't drain (or circulate). New radiator solved the issue.

Dean50



 
wagonman100 
Site Ambassador
Posts: 15355

Loc: Baltimore, MD
Reg: 11-27-04
05-26-21 07:27 PM - Post#2820613    
    In response to johnwd98

While not having the radiator sealed so all air travels through the radiator will make it so air can bypass the radiator, a should will make it so that the fan will pull air through the radiator. A shroud also makes it so it doesn’t matter how far the fan is from the radiator because it directs the pulling force of the fan. My ‘72 Monte Carlo fan is very far from the radiator, but the shroud is about two feet long.

Jay
Friends don’t let friends drive Fords.

1999 Silverado Z71 4X4 extra-cab short bed
1983 Malibu Fauxmad - tubbed
1978 El Camino Kustomized
1972 Monte Carlo
1957 210 handyman wagon
1957 Nomad sport wagon
1957 Cameo Carrier


 
GreatNorthWoods 
"6th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1303
GreatNorthWoods
Age: 79
Loc: Littleton, New Hampshire,...
Reg: 03-31-02
05-27-21 06:16 AM - Post#2820628    
    In response to Airlifter


If the timing and your temp gauge are both correct you may want to consider a shroud or a multi-bladed fan. Heating up while idling can be a result of too little air flow through the radiator. Make sure all the air coming through the front end goes through the radiator and not over or around it.


Vern

1953 Chevy Belair Sport Coupe - 355 Chevy V8, 700-R4, 4-wheel disc brakes, Ididit column, cruise/tilt,'59 Vette Steering Wheel, A/C

1930 DeSoto Business Coupe- 350 Chevy V8, EFI, 4-wheel disc brakes, Wire Wheels, TH400, S-10 Rear, A/C


 
johnwd98 
Contributor
Posts: 577
johnwd98
Age: 72
Loc: Little Falls, MN
Reg: 09-05-10
05-27-21 07:38 AM - Post#2820634    
    In response to wagonman100

  • wagonman100 Said:
While not having the radiator sealed so all air travels through the radiator will make it so air can bypass the radiator, a should will make it so that the fan will pull air through the radiator. A shroud also makes it so it doesn’t matter how far the fan is from the radiator because it directs the pulling force of the fan. My ‘72 Monte Carlo fan is very far from the radiator, but the shroud is about two feet long.



I would be willing to bet the fan is close to the radiator because he replaced the old 6 with a bigger 6 cyl. engine. In that case a fan shroud may do more harm than good by blocking air flow through the corners of the radiator. The shroud would have to be pretty flat, unlike like your Monte Carlo with it's deep, long shroud.


1950 Fleetline, 355 TBI, mild cam, 700R4, 3.73 posi rear Blazer axle, MII front. P/W, Remote door and trunk locks, GM cruise control, A/C.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/54237519@N00/a lbums


 
Airlifter 
"6th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 813
Airlifter
Age: 76
Loc: Tazewell county, Virginia
Reg: 06-07-15
05-27-21 09:49 AM - Post#2820639    
    In response to johnwd98

I changed the thermostat from 180 to 160. I know this will not solve the overheating but it did bring the normal down a bit.

I am wondering a out a partial blockage in the radiator or engine. There's no radiator shop nearby so could I use an infrared sensor to check for hot spots?

1951 styline deluxe sport coupe w/'60 261 engine & 54 powerglide


 
Mel Foye 
*VIP* Original Founding Member Group
Posts: 5271
Mel Foye
Reg: 09-29-00
05-27-21 10:36 AM - Post#2820641    
    In response to Airlifter

  • Airlifter Said:
Rausch, I think is going to get an after market gauge to check accuracy of stock gauge.

Drtyler, the timing was 12 degrees. I had adjusted with vacuum gauge. I backed off to 6 degrees this morning to see if that makes any difference.

Thanks, Pete


Pete, I am NOT a 261 guy but I have some thoughts. 1) adjusting timing by vacuum is not a good method. By timing light is the way. Remove and plug the line to the dist. b4 checking. 2) what is the initial called for the 261?




 
coachfrank 
"6th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 203
coachfrank
Age: 73
Loc: washington,pa
Reg: 07-20-11
05-28-21 10:37 AM - Post#2820704    
    In response to Mel Foye

I did this to the open spot to redirect air while driving. Works great, don't have any temperature problems since installation!

Attachment: IMG_1283.jpg (577.47 KB) 19 View(s)




1975 Corvette, Original owner
1953 Chevy 3100 Pickup
1952 Chevy Styleline Coupe
http://sites.google.com/site/bluejaygarage/


 
Mel Foye 
*VIP* Original Founding Member Group
Posts: 5271
Mel Foye
Reg: 09-29-00
05-28-21 01:26 PM - Post#2820713    
    In response to coachfrank

Functional as air across entire radiator face and great looking. Pretty good job. Mel



 
johnwd98 
Contributor
Posts: 577
johnwd98
Age: 72
Loc: Little Falls, MN
Reg: 09-05-10
05-29-21 04:13 AM - Post#2820749    
    In response to coachfrank

Similar to what I did. Would recommend doing that to anyone, over heating problems or not. It just looks better if nothing else.
By the way the link to your blue jay garage doesn't seem to work for me.

1950 Fleetline, 355 TBI, mild cam, 700R4, 3.73 posi rear Blazer axle, MII front. P/W, Remote door and trunk locks, GM cruise control, A/C.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/54237519@N00/a lbums


 
coachfrank 
"6th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 203
coachfrank
Age: 73
Loc: washington,pa
Reg: 07-20-11
05-29-21 09:22 AM - Post#2820763    
    In response to johnwd98

Thank You John! Try going to my profile and clicking on the site there! Don't have any idea of why it quick working! I am Not very computer literate

1975 Corvette, Original owner
1953 Chevy 3100 Pickup
1952 Chevy Styleline Coupe
http://sites.google.com/site/bluejaygarage/


 
rawaag 
"13th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 457
rawaag
Loc: Williamsburg Virginia
Reg: 06-12-09
05-29-21 12:48 PM - Post#2820776    
    In response to drtyler

A few weeks ago I mentioned the problem with my car running very hot because of the new rebuild. I tried the timing and with a few different settings but got to much spark knock or hard starting. Even with a new aluminum radiator it was running between 195 and 210, which scares me. I installed a pusher fan this week and so far it has been helping. I took it out yesterday and it was 95, in stop and go traffic it never got above 180-190. The fan is set to come on a 180, so it seems to be working. I will give it another try Monday when I go to a Memorial Day car show, about 30 miles away down the interstate.

Ralph


 
G. Baker 
Poster
Posts: 57

Loc: Ontario Canada
Reg: 12-18-15
06-04-21 05:33 AM - Post#2821111    
    In response to Airlifter

I think you should be running a 12-15psi Pressure Cap. Use an infra red temp indicator to see how hot it is really getting at idle.



 
rawaag 
"13th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 457
rawaag
Loc: Williamsburg Virginia
Reg: 06-12-09
06-04-21 07:30 AM - Post#2821122    
    In response to G. Baker

Thanks for the reply. there's a few different theories floating around on what thermostat I should be running and I've tried different one's with about the same results. I think I have the problem resolved since this past weekend the temp didn't get above 180. I have used a hand held device earlier and it wasn't much difference than what my gauge was showing.

Ralph


 
Moparman 
Very Senior Member
Posts: 1319
Moparman
Reg: 06-27-02
06-07-21 06:20 AM - Post#2821272    
    In response to Airlifter

As you know, the thermostat controls the minimum operating temperature. It has no control over maximum temperatures.

You can feel the radiator with your hand to look for cool spots, when the engine is warm. That's probably the cause.

If the radiator checks out, your next step could be to speed up the water pump a touch. Go to a slightly smaller pulley on the pump. The more coolant you circulate through the engine and radiator, the more heat you'll dissipate.



 
VWNate 
Senior Member
Posts: 368
VWNate
Loc: Sunny So.Cal.
Reg: 09-25-02
06-08-21 11:49 AM - Post#2821351    
    In response to Moparman

@ Pete ;

First things first, hot check and adjust the valves .

As mentioned, placing your palm flat against the radiator and moving it from side to side going down from the top with the engine idling, will quickly indicate any clogged tubes .

The timing on these engines is critical ~ there's the BB on the flywheel, it is used to check / adjust the timing at hot idle, there should be NO VACUUM SIGNAL to the dizzy with the engine idling ! .

Set to ball on pointer at or below 600 RPM .


The TDC mark on the flywheel is a triangle, it's very often faintly stamped and hard to see, I like to remove the scatter pan and wire brush the two marks and ad paint marks to make them more visible .

FWIW, as long as you have a pressure cap and you're not loosing coolant it's NOT OVERHEATING .

Remember : each pound of system pressure increases the boiling point of plain water by 3 degrees , I assume you're running a coolant mix so you're well within normal range .

Harbor Freight sells nifty and inexpen$ive I.R. thermometers, I bought the fancy one on sale for $20 years ago and it's still working fine, use it to discover hot spots in the radiator or engine's water jacket .

Before you $pend big $ on a new radiator, try flushing the entire system with citric acid and distilled water, this works a treat .



-Nate
'49 3100 Series Pickup W/'57 235 & Muncie M420 ~ SOLD & Missed .

'69 C10 Stepside shortbed L6 250 , TH350 , P.S. & B.B. side mount spare , NEW Shop Truck soon to have factory AC !


 
Airlifter 
"6th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 813
Airlifter
Age: 76
Loc: Tazewell county, Virginia
Reg: 06-07-15
06-09-21 09:52 AM - Post#2821411    
    In response to VWNate


Thanks for all the responses.

Here is what I have done so far. Backedthe timing to 2 degrees. Added a auxiliary electric fan. Installed a 160 degres thermostat.

I know that the thermostat will not prevent the overheating but it let the engine run a little cooler. I checked the engine and radiator with infrared thermometer and it was pretty consistent and close to the gauge in the car

I have not driven the car under the conditions as last weekend so I don't know what the results will be. The engine is running cooler so maybe it will have a little more of a starting point toward overheating.

1951 styline deluxe sport coupe w/'60 261 engine & 54 powerglide


 


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