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Username Post: Keisler transmission kits        (Topic#76434)
MR_150 
Member
Posts: 43

Loc: merrilville,indiana
Reg: 08-30-02
09-28-04 12:10 PM - Post#519820    

In the latest issue Car Craft magazine there is an article on kits by Keisler Enginering for installing Tremec 5 speed transmissions in various cars. one of them listed is for mid 50`s Chevys.Has anyone out there ever installed one of their kits?Iwould like to hear some pros and cons before i make my move. Was there much cutting of the floor.The article made the swap a piece of cake

 
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patrick_rodgers 
Super Senior Member
Posts: 3977
patrick_rodgers
Age: 57
Loc: Heart of the California G...
Reg: 07-18-03
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-28-04 12:17 PM - Post#519821    
    In response to MR_150

While not answering your question, do a search (say over 1 year) and look at Chevynut's experience with their shipping his tranmission.
1957 Sports Sedan and Nomad

2005 Subaru Legacy wagon (built in Indiana from parts made in the US)


 
chevynut 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 11073
chevynut
Loc: Ft. Collins, CO .....
Reg: 09-22-01
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-28-04 12:45 PM - Post#519822    
    In response to MR_150

Yes, search on past posts on this .

I ordered a Keisler Viper T56 over a year ago and it took 11 weeks to get it. They originally told me 4-6 weeks because I didn't order a complete kit, just the tranny. When I called them later, they told me that Tremec was short on parts so they couldn't get me one for 10 weeks. Then they told me they'd ship one right away, but whenever I called it was another excuse. Once they told me they had to build one to get it out. I called Mike Forte and he told me he could get one from Tremec with no problem.

I thought it was something special, but when I got it I found out it was just a stock Viper T56 with an adapter plate bolted to it. It was VERY obvious that they did nothing to it, and when I asked Keisler about what they did, I was told "it's proprietary". BS. I confirmed that it was a stock Viper part, and I've bought two brand new (stronger) ones since at almost half the price (without the $350 adapter).

As Patrick said, mine came damaged in shipment too, but they fixed it...another 2 week delay.

If I were you I'd shop around. I wouldn't deal with Keisler again, myself. I think you'll pay a premium with Keisler, but they do have a full kit. To tell the truth I'm not sure why you think you need a kit because you can get all the parts you need separately elsewhere. These are made to use stock Chevy parts and it should be easy to do.

Give Mike Forte a call, or check with This place.
'56 Nomad, C4 Vette F&R suspension, Ramjet 502, Viper T56 6 speed See My Nomad Build
'56 BelAir 2DR Sedan in waiting
'01 Porsche Boxster S
'03 Chevy Silverado 2500HD 4x4 Duramax


 
Rick_L 
Honored Member
Posts: 25766

Loc: Katy, Tx, USA
Reg: 07-06-00
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-28-04 01:10 PM - Post#519823    
    In response to chevynut

I think the consensus from postings on this board and others is that Mike Forte and Mike Pell both have better pricing and customer service than Keisler. I see mixed reviews on D&D and the most negative comments about Keisler.

For the most part they can all sell you the same thing, especially with the 5 speeds, because a lot of it comes from Tremec. Keisler seems to have more 6 speed options advertised, but you should ask the others about them even if they don't advertise them.

Another route you can take on a 6 speed is to buy a used T56 out of a Camaro or Viper and rebuild it yourself. There are a couple of places selling T56 rebuild parts on Ebay very reasonably.

 
No_Dice 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 13762
No_Dice
Loc: San Jose, CA
Reg: 04-23-01
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-28-04 01:23 PM - Post#519824    
    In response to Rick_L

Don't forget Richmond. http://www.richmondgear.com/ Mine is a dream to drive


 
chevynut 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 11073
chevynut
Loc: Ft. Collins, CO .....
Reg: 09-22-01
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-28-04 02:23 PM - Post#519825    
    In response to Rick_L

Quote:

Another route you can take on a 6 speed is to buy a used T56 out of a Camaro or Viper and rebuild it yourself. There are a couple of places selling T56 rebuild parts on Ebay very reasonably.




Now that you can buy the adapter plate separately for the Viper tranny, that's a good way to go. I think you can get a low-mileage one for $1100 or so and the adapter costs $350. It allows you to use a stock 26-spline Chevy clutch setup, once you get a 0.700" bore pilot bushing. I like where the Viper's shifter is too, but I replaced mine with a Hurst from an "aftermarket" T56.
'56 Nomad, C4 Vette F&R suspension, Ramjet 502, Viper T56 6 speed See My Nomad Build
'56 BelAir 2DR Sedan in waiting
'01 Porsche Boxster S
'03 Chevy Silverado 2500HD 4x4 Duramax


 
5Larry7 
"11th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1753
5Larry7
Loc: Dallas, TX
Reg: 05-17-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-28-04 02:58 PM - Post#519826    
    In response to MR_150

In the "for what it's worth" catagorey, I have a Tremec 5 speed in my '57. I looked at the Kit form Keisler and ended up buying the trans and yoke from Standard Transmission of Forth Worth, TX and accumulating the reat of the parts from various sources. The overall cost when I was done was less than if I had bought the kit from Keisler. I did not have to cut the floor for the transmission, but the shifter does stick up through the floor. The large Hurst boot covers it nicely. The dirveshaft needs to be shortened and the yoke uses a different size u-joint than stock. I got the shifter itself from Keisler along with Hurst handle. The shifter I used is for the middle positon, and I do not think any other position will work. I did not like the handle and ended up making one myself. Keisler was a little slow refunding my money for the handle and if it were not for the fact that I sent it back with a confirmation that they got it, I got the feeling they would not have refunded my money. I got the adapter for speedo and rear mount (a Musang part) from D & D. The transmission is quite a bit heaver than the Muncie, so I would strongly recommend a rear crossmember instead of letting it hang ala stock. I am very happy with the overall results. By the way, I run a 3.73:1 rear gear.
'57 210, Blown 327 cid, Holley HP TBI, 700R4, A/C
'51 Studebaker Starlite coupe, 350, TH400, GV OD.
'96 Replica of a 1950's Teardrop Trailer.


 
hotwheels57 
Senior Member
Posts: 8602
hotwheels57
Reg: 11-20-02
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-28-04 03:28 PM - Post#519827    
    In response to MR_150

I have a TREMAC in my '57 150 sedan behind a ZZ4. I got everything from MIKE FORTES. The shifter is in the middle position which is just right for a bench seat. It could be placed further back if you use bucket seats.
The shifter handle is a matter of preferance and MR. GASKET/HURST has a website with the demensions of several available in shape, height and bend angles.
If you like the C shaped shifter that came on the HURST shifters specific to '55-56-57, then check out the LONG website. They offer a bolt on C-shaped stick that will bolt on to any stub that is the HURST specs for center to center of the mounting bolts.
The floor pan did not have to be cut on my installation, but that mostly depends on the placement of side engine mounts. If you decide on side engine mounts that do not move the engine forward 3/4", then you may have to cut your floor pan. If you use the side engine mounts that move the engine forward 3/4", then you should just squeak by without any modifications.
Karma is the universal equalizer. The Ignore User feature comes in a close second.


 
MR_150 
Member
Posts: 43

Loc: merrilville,indiana
Reg: 08-30-02
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-29-04 12:39 PM - Post#519828    
    In response to hotwheels57

If i use the tremac 5-speed in my 57 with the engine using the front engine. mounts,will i need to make any modifications to my floor other than the hole made for the shifter.also how big of a hole is needed for the shifter.Which transmission would shift smoother,a Richmond 5-speed or the Tremec 5-speed.Which one would be the better of the two

 
hotwheels57 
Senior Member
Posts: 8602
hotwheels57
Reg: 11-20-02
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-29-04 01:11 PM - Post#519829    
    In response to MR_150

I can't answer that question about using the front engine mounts and a TREMAC. Possibly, MIKE FORTES could answer that.
CT member cardoc has a TREMAC in his '56 Nomad and he may have used oem front mounts for his stealthy and healthy 265 with an oem 2x4 setup. He may reply to this thread or you can send him a PM or e-mail. I know he did have to split his transmission hump and add sheet metal with his installation while mine did not require any such modification with 3/4" forward side mounts.
The shifter tower will protrude above the sheet metal transmission hump. The hole depends on how big you want to make it. Here's a link to one of the images on my website that shows how much the shifter tower protrudes into the transmission hump.
http://myweb.cableone.net/rottie3054/57%20Web%20Pages/57%20Web%20Photos/DSinterior.jpg
If the body is off the chassis as mine was, then the hole can be cut very small, leaving just about 1/2" space from the shifter tower. A HURST Super Boot will cover that easily, but you could probably use any of the HURST boots or have one made out of matching interior fabric. EBAY has shifter boots for different applications that would probably work.
As to which transmission will shift smoother, I can only respond to my experience with the TREMAC. It has smooth short throw shifts, but I'm certain that a RICHMOND is just as smooth. A TREMAC has an internal rail shifter, like a late model Mustang. The bottom of the shifter has a ball which slips into a female socket shift mechanism in the transmission body. There is no external linkage to attach to the tailshaft. The shifter is centered on the transmission which will put the shifter almost dead center in the transmission hump as opposed to off the left side of a RICHMOND transmission. If you already have a hole in your transmission hump from a four speed, the hole will not correspond to where the TREMAC shifter will protrude. My experience with bolt on HURST type shifters on Muncie four speeds was that they worked well. They do need periodic service since they're exposed to the elements. They may present hard shifting or noises because of that, but nothing that can't be eliminated with cleaning or replacement bushings. The bolt on linkage have to be adjusted correctly to provide you with crisp and smooth shifting. Since the TREMAC shifter is internal, you don't have those issues. You can compensate for the shifter being in the middle of the transmission hump with minor bending or different shift levers available. A RICHMOND five speed is not an overdrive, so you'd need to step up to a RICHMOND 6 speed if your goal if overdrive. Cost wise, both are similar. It's all depends on what gear ratios you want and whether you want externally bolt on linkage or internal rail linkage.
Karma is the universal equalizer. The Ignore User feature comes in a close second.


 
chevynut 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 11073
chevynut
Loc: Ft. Collins, CO .....
Reg: 09-22-01
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-29-04 01:27 PM - Post#519830    
    In response to hotwheels57

Quote:

A RICHMOND five speed is not an overdrive, so you'd need to step up to a RICHMOND 6 speed if your goal if overdrive. Cost wise, both are similar.




The ROD 6-speed is $2900 at Summit, and the T56 6-speed is about $2400 or so with adapter plate. I have seen the TKO-600 for $1818 at Fortes.

You might want to look at THIS.
'56 Nomad, C4 Vette F&R suspension, Ramjet 502, Viper T56 6 speed See My Nomad Build
'56 BelAir 2DR Sedan in waiting
'01 Porsche Boxster S
'03 Chevy Silverado 2500HD 4x4 Duramax


 
5Larry7 
"11th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1753
5Larry7
Loc: Dallas, TX
Reg: 05-17-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
09-29-04 05:07 PM - Post#519831    
    In response to MR_150

I would not reccomend using oem front mounts and a rear cross member. I converted to side mounts along with the rear cross member. As I said in my earlier post, he Tremec is considerably heavier that the Muncie.
'57 210, Blown 327 cid, Holley HP TBI, 700R4, A/C
'51 Studebaker Starlite coupe, 350, TH400, GV OD.
'96 Replica of a 1950's Teardrop Trailer.


 
KEISLER 
Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 9

Loc: TN
Reg: 10-22-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-22-04 01:24 AM - Post#519832    
    In response to MR_150

Quote:

In the latest issue Car Craft magazine there is an article on kits by Keisler Enginering for installing Tremec 5 speed transmissions in various cars. one of them listed is for mid 50`s Chevys.Has anyone out there ever installed one of their kits?Iwould like to hear some pros and cons before i make my move. Was there much cutting of the floor.The article made the swap a piece of cake




Mr 150,

We have provided hundreds of 5 & 6-speed kits to '55-57 owners. Here are some points to consider:
1. FLOOR TUNNEL MODIFICATION - Either transmission WILL require some floor tunnel hump modification. We have a new ROLLED STEEL TUNNEL HUMP for our 5 & 6-speed kits coming on line in 2-3 months. This is a drop in affair.
2. 5 VS 6 - The 5-speed offers the best value for the money and what we recommend if you simply want an overdrive.
3. SHORT THROW - Both of our kits now offer a short throw shifter mechanism with the transmission. With the bench seat handle, the throw is approx 5.5 inch (5-speed).
4. PRO SHIFTER - We now offer a PRO SHIFTER upgrade for the 6-speed at very low cost. This adds internal spring biasing to the shifter mechanism for better control. The double overdrive 6-speed is a better transmission only from the standpoint of shift quality, which is a bit better than the fantastic 5-speed we offer.
5. CUSTOMIZATION - KEY POINT: Our tranmissions are completely customized - not an "out of the box" Tremec transmission. The 5-speed has our unique, Keisler mini-billet short throw shifter which installs from the INSIDE of the car, so it installs much easier than a regular Tremec.
The 6-speed has our unique FRONT SHIFT design that was never made by Tremec. We designed it and brought it to market in early 2003. NO ONE offers a shifter as ours. Using the tailhousing position shifter will not work on a factory bench seat application unless - that's just one reason we designed the shifter in the unique position we offer.
We also build each unit to blueprint specs, and upgrade some internal components making the transmission even better. Our product is unique and proprietary in nature - not what you will find from other vendors. A driveline system is a big investment and we have made a big investment in providing the properly designed parts for your TRI-5, street rod, truck or muscle car.
6. We are a AUTHORIZED FULL LINE DISTRIBUTOR - just one of a few companies that actually rebuild transmissions, sell service parts, etc. Most other companies simply want your money, and can't perform the service in-house. Coming shortly, Tremec is making some changes that will further seperate the elite full service distributors like us from the internet low-ballers that offer no value added service and parts inventory. Ask the sales rep from the company you are taking to if HIS company is an authorized distributor, or they simply a reseller for an authorized distributor. There's a BIG difference.
7. PRICE - Our prices are unbeatable and when you see a lower price, it is not an apples-apples comparison, regardless of what someone may have told you. The buy the transmissions DIRECTLY from Tremec and pick them up at Tremec's world-wide production and distribution facility just down the street. We buy at the LOWEST PRICE, and offer you the same, AND we have a BEST PRICE GUARANTEE.
8. EXPERIENCE - No company has more experience developing, manufacturing and installing TREMEC transmissions in GM than Keisler. While D&D and Fortes have been selling Tremecs about 4 years longer than us, there is no comparison as to the technical know-how we offer coming from hands on installation. We have over 20 employees dedicated to designing, manufacturing and selling the product line - compare that to any else and you will see a BIG difference in what we bring to the table.
9. TECHNOLOGY - We simply have the BEST technology in the market. With 3 degreed mechanical and electrical engineers on staff, plus expert machinists, metal fabricators, assembly technicians and well trained sales and technical staff, we offer the best product technology. We lead where others follow. For example, Tremec realized our offset shifter technology was important to the market, and made their own version of sorts. However, it is much different than what we offer, and NOT a substitute. Others in the marketplace try to mimic our product marketing. Don't be fooled - there is no substitute for the years and thousands of man-hours that go into developing a product properly. We are a SYSTEMS ENGINEERING company - that means we make it ALL work together, as GM, Chrysler, Ford and other companies did when the vehicles were new.
10. CUSTOMER SERVICE - For 2004, Keisler has refocused customer service as our #1 goal. Due to problems with Tremec not supplying the market strongly for approximately 5 months, problems including unhappy long wait customers, developed. This has hurt our reputation slightly, and we are aware that we need to improve customer service. Since July 2004, we have taken strong measures to improve the customer service, including: hired 2 more people just to answer the phone and answer questions so you don't get the automated voice mail system as frequently, hired a business manager to help the office and customer paperwork, hired 4 more people in production to build units faster, purchased a $50,000 inventory control system to aid in the manufacture of product, tracking, shipping and many other features. These are just a few of the things we have done, and our customer service has recently improved dramatically. We don't hide the fact we have had problems. We are people helping people, and we - like anyone else - required time to adjust our way of operation to better everyone.

Car Craft's article was well done. Also, check out the Chevy High Performance article that Ro McGonegal did on our company in the June and July issues. You can read them on our newly revised website below. It covers installation of popular kits we make.

Also, our revised web site will feature a brand new product line - the BUILDER'S SERIES. Check it out - lower prices, complete quality Keisler kit. We also have single units available for easy review and ordering.

We get a lot of calls, and you may have to leave a message, but that is the BEST way to contact us. Our mission is to provide you the best product at the best price with the best service - PERIOD!

Thanks for your time to read this length post.

Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO
Keisler Engineering, Inc.
www.keislerauto.com/gm
5 & 6-SPEED OVERDRIVE TRANSMISSIONS SYSTEMS
Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO Keisler Engineering, Inc. 5 & 6-Speed Overdrive Transmission Systems


 
KEISLER 
Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 9

Loc: TN
Reg: 10-22-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-22-04 01:53 AM - Post#519833    
    In response to chevynut

Lazlo,
Sorry we didn't make you 100% satisfied during your purchase. I know we had some problems with your order - we have made some big changes since then (see above post). When I saw you at the Power Tour and you displayed your car at our booth for the Hot Rod TV shoot, I though everything was OK. Please call me 865-609-8187 x203 and I'd like to know how we can make you happy. We strive for 100% satifaction. Let's see what we can do for you.
Thanks,
Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO Keisler Engineering, Inc. 5 & 6-Speed Overdrive Transmission Systems


 
Nick P 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 5928
Nick P
Age: 67
Loc: De Queen, Arkansas
Reg: 10-15-03
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-22-04 03:32 AM - Post#519834    
    In response to KEISLER

Quote:


Mr 150,

We have provided hundreds of 5 & 6-speed kits to '55-57 owners. Here are some points to consider:
1. FLOOR TUNNEL MODIFICATION - Either transmission WILL require some floor tunnel hump modification. We have a new ROLLED STEEL TUNNEL HUMP for our 5 & 6-speed kits coming on line in 2-3 months. This is a drop in affair.
2. 5 VS 6 - The 5-speed offers the best value for the money and what we recommend if you simply want an overdrive.
3. SHORT THROW - Both of our kits now offer a short throw shifter mechanism with the transmission. With the bench seat handle, the throw is approx 5.5 inch (5-speed).
4. PRO SHIFTER - We now offer a PRO SHIFTER upgrade for the 6-speed at very low cost. This adds internal spring biasing to the shifter mechanism for better control. The double overdrive 6-speed is a better transmission only from the standpoint of shift quality, which is a bit better than the fantastic 5-speed we offer.
5. CUSTOMIZATION - KEY POINT: Our tranmissions are completely customized - not an "out of the box" Tremec transmission. The 5-speed has our unique, Keisler mini-billet short throw shifter which installs from the INSIDE of the car, so it installs much easier than a regular Tremec.
The 6-speed has our unique FRONT SHIFT design that was never made by Tremec. We designed it and brought it to market in early 2003. NO ONE offers a shifter as ours. Using the tailhousing position shifter will not work on a factory bench seat application unless - that's just one reason we designed the shifter in the unique position we offer.
We also build each unit to blueprint specs, and upgrade some internal components making the transmission even better. Our product is unique and proprietary in nature - not what you will find from other vendors. A driveline system is a big investment and we have made a big investment in providing the properly designed parts for your TRI-5, street rod, truck or muscle car.
6. We are a AUTHORIZED FULL LINE DISTRIBUTOR - just one of a few companies that actually rebuild transmissions, sell service parts, etc. Most other companies simply want your money, and can't perform the service in-house. Coming shortly, Tremec is making some changes that will further seperate the elite full service distributors like us from the internet low-ballers that offer no value added service and parts inventory. Ask the sales rep from the company you are taking to if HIS company is an authorized distributor, or they simply a reseller for an authorized distributor. There's a BIG difference.
7. PRICE - Our prices are unbeatable and when you see a lower price, it is not an apples-apples comparison, regardless of what someone may have told you. The buy the transmissions DIRECTLY from Tremec and pick them up at Tremec's world-wide production and distribution facility just down the street. We buy at the LOWEST PRICE, and offer you the same, AND we have a BEST PRICE GUARANTEE.
8. EXPERIENCE - No company has more experience developing, manufacturing and installing TREMEC transmissions in GM than Keisler. While D&D and Fortes have been selling Tremecs about 4 years longer than us, there is no comparison as to the technical know-how we offer coming from hands on installation. We have over 20 employees dedicated to designing, manufacturing and selling the product line - compare that to any else and you will see a BIG difference in what we bring to the table.
9. TECHNOLOGY - We simply have the BEST technology in the market. With 3 degreed mechanical and electrical engineers on staff, plus expert machinists, metal fabricators, assembly technicians and well trained sales and technical staff, we offer the best product technology. We lead where others follow. For example, Tremec realized our offset shifter technology was important to the market, and made their own version of sorts. However, it is much different than what we offer, and NOT a substitute. Others in the marketplace try to mimic our product marketing. Don't be fooled - there is no substitute for the years and thousands of man-hours that go into developing a product properly. We are a SYSTEMS ENGINEERING company - that means we make it ALL work together, as GM, Chrysler, Ford and other companies did when the vehicles were new.
10. CUSTOMER SERVICE - For 2004, Keisler has refocused customer service as our #1 goal. Due to problems with Tremec not supplying the market strongly for approximately 5 months, problems including unhappy long wait customers, developed. This has hurt our reputation slightly, and we are aware that we need to improve customer service. Since July 2004, we have taken strong measures to improve the customer service, including: hired 2 more people just to answer the phone and answer questions so you don't get the automated voice mail system as frequently, hired a business manager to help the office and customer paperwork, hired 4 more people in production to build units faster, purchased a $50,000 inventory control system to aid in the manufacture of product, tracking, shipping and many other features. These are just a few of the things we have done, and our customer service has recently improved dramatically. We don't hide the fact we have had problems. We are people helping people, and we - like anyone else - required time to adjust our way of operation to better everyone.

Car Craft's article was well done. Also, check out the Chevy High Performance article that Ro McGonegal did on our company in the June and July issues. You can read them on our newly revised website below. It covers installation of popular kits we make.

Also, our revised web site will feature a brand new product line - the BUILDER'S SERIES. Check it out - lower prices, complete quality Keisler kit. We also have single units available for easy review and ordering.

We get a lot of calls, and you may have to leave a message, but that is the BEST way to contact us. Our mission is to provide you the best product at the best price with the best service - PERIOD!

Thanks for your time to read this length post.

Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO
Keisler Engineering, Inc.
www.keislerauto.com/gm
5 & 6-SPEED OVERDRIVE TRANSMISSIONS SYSTEMS



I know this is a defense reply by this provider, but it certainly looks like a solicitation, or maybe I just missed the boat on this one – I know I and others have been locked out or other methods of curtailment by the CT.ORG POLICE for doing far less – WHAT GIVES?
Life is not the way it's supposed to be. It's the
way it is. The way you cope with it, is what makes
the difference.


 
KEISLER 
Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 9

Loc: TN
Reg: 10-22-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-22-04 05:11 AM - Post#519835    
    In response to Nick P

NPrime,

Sorry if my post raised your eyebrows. It was not meant to be an advert. One of the members raised issues that needed to be addressed. No prices were discussed, and I don't intend to use this forum as a means for advertising. That's what we pay the magazines big money to do for us.
Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO Keisler Engineering, Inc. 5 & 6-Speed Overdrive Transmission Systems


 
chevynut 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 11073
chevynut
Loc: Ft. Collins, CO .....
Reg: 09-22-01
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-22-04 06:23 AM - Post#519836    
    In response to KEISLER

Quote:

[We also build each unit to blueprint specs, and upgrade some internal components making the transmission even better. Our product is unique and proprietary in nature - not what you will find from other vendors.




The Viper T56 that I bought from you had NEVER been opened up, based on my observation of the bolts, seams, gaskets, etc. I was shipped a BONE STOCK Viper tranny, that you got direct from Tremec, in my judgment. When I asked you what you did to "blueprint" it you wouldn't tell me. I don't like doing business with a company who won't even let the customer know what he's paying for.

The only thing "Proprietary" and perhaps "unique" about your trannys is the forward mount shifter. I didn't get that. I didn't get the mechanical speedo conversion either, which is offered by others. I believe that design was actually pioneered by Mike Forte and copied (stolen, according to Mike) by other companies.

My adapter plate was made wrong, and didn't bolt up correctly to the bellhousing. Holes were double-drilled and egg-shaped. It was improperly "clocked". After several calls and e-mails, I was finally informed that I got a "prototype" part and a new one was being designed for me. This should not have happened and caused even more delays.

The bottom line is that I feel that I was somewhat "duped" into over-paying for something that I thought I was getting (a "blueprinted", upgraded Viper tranny). I paid $2450 for the tranny that I could have bought elsewhere for $2100-2200. I was quoted $125 for shipping, but charged $150. I was informed that the trannys weren't available because of a shortage, when in fact I could get one from anyone else in a week. I found that out after I'd waited for 9 weeks for one from Keisler. I also had a huge hassle with the adapter and poor packing that caused the driveshaft seal to get torn, requiring me to ship it back. I do appreciate your concern to check it out to be sure that the tranny didn't get hurt, though.

Quote:

Our prices are unbeatable and when you see a lower price, it is not an apples-apples comparison, regardless of what someone may have told you.




Not true in my case. I could have bought the same thing for less elsewhere. It may be true for other models, but not the Viper T56. The one advantage you have is that you sell a complete kit, if someone needs/wants it.

Quote:

AND we have a BEST PRICE GUARANTEE.




Now you're talking . Are you offering to refund the difference if I send you an ad for less than I paid last year? I seriously doubt it.

Quote:

For 2004, Keisler has refocused customer service as our #1 goal. Due to problems with Tremec not supplying the market strongly for approximately 5 months, problems including unhappy long wait customers, developed. This has hurt our reputation slightly, and we are aware that we need to improve customer service.




That's definitely a step in the right directiojn. I was upset that I couldn't get e-amil replies to my questions, and when I called people didn't call back. Then I got a different story about what was going on with my tranny from 3-4 people I talked to.

I am a "builder" and all I ordered was a tranny, nothing else. I really didn't like the hassle I went through with Keisler.

By the way, I have bought TWO brand new TUET-1806 550 ft-lb Viper trannys for almost half the price of the one I got from you. Not sure what I'm going to do with them yet.
'56 Nomad, C4 Vette F&R suspension, Ramjet 502, Viper T56 6 speed See My Nomad Build
'56 BelAir 2DR Sedan in waiting
'01 Porsche Boxster S
'03 Chevy Silverado 2500HD 4x4 Duramax


 
chevynut 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 11073
chevynut
Loc: Ft. Collins, CO .....
Reg: 09-22-01
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-22-04 06:33 AM - Post#519837    
    In response to KEISLER

Shafi, I actually appreciate you coming here to discuss these issues with us. We've had reps from Air-ride and Hot Rod Air on here.

One thing I want to know....please explain your HP/torque ratings to me.

You say on your website that you can get a "450 HP" or a "650 HP" T56. I never could understand how you can rate a tranny by horsepower.

Then on THIS PAGE you list a Viper T56 as 650 ft-lb. I believe that's false. The "regular" Viper T56 (TNET-1247) that you sell is rated by Tremec at 450 ft-lb. The improved 2003 and up T56 (TUET-1806) is rated at 550 ft-lb. The Tremec specs are listed HERE. Please explain this discrepancy.

You told me you can't get the TUET-1806 Viper tranny and that they are reserved for Chrysler only. You also told me it was a $4500 tranny. I have two of them. Can you tell me what's different between the 1806 and the 1247?

So, how can you specify a 650 ft-lb torque rating for the "T56-Viper" you sell?
'56 Nomad, C4 Vette F&R suspension, Ramjet 502, Viper T56 6 speed See My Nomad Build
'56 BelAir 2DR Sedan in waiting
'01 Porsche Boxster S
'03 Chevy Silverado 2500HD 4x4 Duramax


 
5Larry7 
"11th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1753
5Larry7
Loc: Dallas, TX
Reg: 05-17-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-22-04 06:46 AM - Post#519838    
    In response to KEISLER

"1. FLOOR TUNNEL MODIFICATION - Either transmission WILL require some floor tunnel hump modification. We have a new ROLLED STEEL TUNNEL HUMP for our 5 & 6-speed kits coming on line in 2-3 months. This is a drop in affair."

I have a Tremec 5-speed in my '57 with no floor cutting except the hole where the shifter goes through. The trans is quite close to the floor, but I have had no problems with it hitting or anything else. The shifter extends through the floor and must be isntalled after the trans is in place. I would also suggest using side mounts with a rear crossmember. I would shop all the vendors that sell the Tremec before laying any money down. Just my 2 cents worth.
'57 210, Blown 327 cid, Holley HP TBI, 700R4, A/C
'51 Studebaker Starlite coupe, 350, TH400, GV OD.
'96 Replica of a 1950's Teardrop Trailer.


 
KEISLER 
Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 9

Loc: TN
Reg: 10-22-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-22-04 09:57 AM - Post#519839    
    In response to chevynut

Lazlo,

Thanks for your reply. And, by the way, I do not mind the constructive feedback. I'll post a reply this weekend when I have more time.

Thanks again,
Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO Keisler Engineering, Inc. 5 & 6-Speed Overdrive Transmission Systems


 
KEISLER 
Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 9

Loc: TN
Reg: 10-22-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-23-04 10:46 AM - Post#519840    
    In response to chevynut

Laszlo,

I'll reply to your questions as best I can, without offending others in the regards to price issues as I don't want people to think I am trying to advertise here.

First, nearly all transmissions are disassembled and built to blueprint spec. This may have not been the case for you since you did not get our custom street rod shifter position.

Regarding the adapter plate, sorry about that. That does not happen - that a prototype or test piece was out. We now manufacture that adapter plate ourselves to insure quality and we also place different mounting configurations on them for different engines and car models.

Regarding price, all I can say the price we charged for a brand new Viper with the adapter plate was approx $350 more than Tremec minimum sale price for a bare Viper transmission - not a custom unit set up for mechanical linkage. If you don't feel you got a great deal at KEISLER, then call us, and we'll make it RIGHT.

As far as mechanical speedo output, we offer the electronic with a mechanical transducer option. This is not like our mechanical speedo output 475HP unit. I'm not sure what you are talking about with the Forte's comment. We have nothing in common with them other than we both buy our transmissions from Tremec. The difference stops there - no sharing of other parts, designs - anything. Fortes doesn't have kind words to say about any of his competitors.

I asked Tremec if we could buy the new model - they said they were only for Chrysler. That's what I passed on to you. That unit has minimal/no advantage for 99% of our customers, so I haven't pursued it.

About the torque rating, Tremec underates the transmissions - all of them. For example, the new TKO-600 was tested to over 1400 FT-LB with no failure! The T56 line falls under the OEM torque specification class, which is drastically underates the capacity. This is somewhat of a price issue for the OEMs, who do not want to pay for something they don't need. So the "rated" capacity is less. We advertise the capacity based on actual, real world conditions. So far, I have never had a customer break one of our units. And many of our customers run 540ci or larger motors making torque over 650ft-lb.

I hope this answers your questions. Laszlo, please feel to call me directly at 865-609-8187 x203 to discuss anything.

Thanks,

Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO Keisler Engineering, Inc. 5 & 6-Speed Overdrive Transmission Systems


 
hotwheels57 
Senior Member
Posts: 8602
hotwheels57
Reg: 11-20-02
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-23-04 01:25 PM - Post#519841    
    In response to KEISLER

and send him a free t-shirt or hat...
Karma is the universal equalizer. The Ignore User feature comes in a close second.


 
Craig Morrison 
Art Morrison / Site Sponsor
Posts: 1107

Loc: Puyallup, Washington, USA
Reg: 01-29-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-23-04 01:52 PM - Post#519842    
    In response to chevynut

Quote:

Shafi, I actually appreciate you coming here to discuss these issues with us. We've had reps from Air-ride and Hot Rod Air on here.




Ah-hem, Ah-hem. What about that rep from that chassis company up in the Pacific Northwest? Greg or Chris or Craig something.........



 
Rick_L 
Honored Member
Posts: 25766

Loc: Katy, Tx, USA
Reg: 07-06-00
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-24-04 02:04 AM - Post#519843    
    In response to KEISLER

"First, nearly all transmissions are disassembled and built to blueprint spec. This may have not been the case for you since you did not get our custom street rod shifter position."

Keisler, what does the "blueprinting" consist of? How do you decide? Seems like they all should get it if this is of any substance.

 
chevynut 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 11073
chevynut
Loc: Ft. Collins, CO .....
Reg: 09-22-01
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-24-04 08:37 AM - Post#519844    
    In response to hotwheels57

Quote:

and send him a free t-shirt or hat...




Hey, I do like that idea . At this point, I'm not going to argue about pricing. I appreciate the reply, Shafi. Some of your explanations do make sense.

Just to clarify, I didn't want the mechanical speedo since I'm going electronic. I understand how the adapter plate thing happened, but it shouldn't have happened. Hopefully you guys have things under control a little better than you did a year ago.

Have you guys taken an 1806 apart yet to see what's different about it? I assume it's similar to what the M22 Muncie is to the M21. I suppose the gears are cut at less of an angle, and maybe they're cryo-treated? I haven't even looked a them except to look inside the shifter area. It' pretty obvious in looking there and at the input shaft that these are brand new trannys.
'56 Nomad, C4 Vette F&R suspension, Ramjet 502, Viper T56 6 speed See My Nomad Build
'56 BelAir 2DR Sedan in waiting
'01 Porsche Boxster S
'03 Chevy Silverado 2500HD 4x4 Duramax


 
Nick P 
"8th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 5928
Nick P
Age: 67
Loc: De Queen, Arkansas
Reg: 10-15-03
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-24-04 02:44 PM - Post#519845    
    In response to KEISLER

Quote:

Lazlo,

Thanks for your reply. And, by the way, I do not mind the constructive feedback. I'll post a reply this weekend when I have more time.

Thanks again,

--------------------
Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO
Keisler Engineering, Inc.
www.keislerauto.com
865-609-8187
5 & 6-Speed Overdrive Transmission Systems





Quote:

"For clarification purposes- here's our definition of an ad.

It's ok to link a site if you don't profit from the recommendation or are not affiliated with the site.
It's not ok to link your own business or profit from the recommendation. "




Still say this violates the rules set by the CT.ORG POLICE
Life is not the way it's supposed to be. It's the
way it is. The way you cope with it, is what makes
the difference.


 
KEISLER 
Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 9

Loc: TN
Reg: 10-22-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-24-04 03:13 PM - Post#519846    
    In response to Rick_L

Quote:

"First, nearly all transmissions are disassembled and built to blueprint spec. This may have not been the case for you since you did not get our custom street rod shifter position."

Keisler, what does the "blueprinting" consist of? How do you decide? Seems like they all should get it if this is of any substance.




Rick_L,
Good question. When we reassemble the transmission, there are a number of inspections we make. One example is end play/preload. From our experience, we have a set this to a special amount which is different than factory, but within factory specifications such that the unit will run quiet and bearings last longer. We have a long quality check sheet of items, and the QC sheet is different based on model and application. We also make any corrections to the unit after it left the factory based on other quality factors.
Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO Keisler Engineering, Inc. 5 & 6-Speed Overdrive Transmission Systems


 
KEISLER 
Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 9

Loc: TN
Reg: 10-22-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-24-04 03:17 PM - Post#519847    
    In response to chevynut

Quote:

Quote:

and send him a free t-shirt or hat...




Hey, I do like that idea . At this point, I'm not going to argue about pricing. I appreciate the reply, Shafi. Some of your explanations do make sense.

Just to clarify, I didn't want the mechanical speedo since I'm going electronic. I understand how the adapter plate thing happened, but it shouldn't have happened. Hopefully you guys have things under control a little better than you did a year ago.

Have you guys taken an 1806 apart yet to see what's different about it? I assume it's similar to what the M22 Muncie is to the M21. I suppose the gears are cut at less of an angle, and maybe they're cryo-treated? I haven't even looked a them except to look inside the shifter area. It' pretty obvious in looking there and at the input shaft that these are brand new trannys.




Hi Laszlo,
I saw an 1806 in the Tremec lab some months ago. It does have a different countershaft construction and is stronger than a regular new spec Viper unit. However, the new spec Viper is so strong it really doesn't add much value for most guys. I'd like to sell them new one day, regardless.

Also, I'm sending you a shirt and hat, and something else (surprise). Thanks for your feedback on the forum!
Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO Keisler Engineering, Inc. 5 & 6-Speed Overdrive Transmission Systems


 
Rick_L 
Honored Member
Posts: 25766

Loc: Katy, Tx, USA
Reg: 07-06-00
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-24-04 03:18 PM - Post#519848    
    In response to Nick P

Easy, Nick, surely you have some medication coming in the mail.

He's offering some rebuttal (however weak) to complaints lodged, as well as other info, I say let him speak and we'll be the judge, not the moderators. Guess we'll see how Steve thinks on this.

 
KEISLER 
Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 9

Loc: TN
Reg: 10-22-04
Re: Keisler transmission kits
10-24-04 03:19 PM - Post#519849    
    In response to Nick P

Nprime,
I removed my web link and phone number per your recommendation.
Shafi Keisler, Pres/CEO Keisler Engineering, Inc. 5 & 6-Speed Overdrive Transmission Systems


 
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