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Username Post: Engine at Auction Need to Identify        (Topic#343633)
Circle.T.Farm 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 51
Circle.T.Farm
Loc: Arkansas
Reg: 07-13-15
03-28-17 05:09 PM - Post#2683910    

I located a inline 6, that came out of a '58 Chevrolet 1.5 ton. It will be auctioned Sunday. Trying to identify size. Head number is 3836848. Above starter casting number is Con 4 F25 and another number located to the left of distributor is 0627056F55Z. I'm hoping it is a 261 with the head that so many people look for. Any help appreciated or places I can search information.

1952 Chevy 3100, 235ci 6cyl., 12v system


 
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raycow 
Honored Member
Posts: 26833
raycow
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Reg: 11-26-02
03-29-17 09:50 AM - Post#2684015    
    In response to Circle.T.Farm

F55Z is a Flint-built 1955 manual transmission passenger car engine. The casting date decodes as June 2, 1955. Your 848 head is newer than the block and was probably swapped because the original 1955 head would not accept the stock 1958 temp gauge sender without modification.

Ray

Those who choose an automatic transmission want transportation. Those who choose a manual transmission want to drive.


 
Circle.T.Farm 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 51
Circle.T.Farm
Loc: Arkansas
Reg: 07-13-15
03-29-17 10:58 AM - Post#2684028    
    In response to raycow

Thanks Ray, I'm going to stop by there again before the auction and see if I can find any more numbers. So, by the numbers I have collected do you think it is a 235 or 261? I have two trucks I could use the engine in the other one is a 1964 Chev. 1 ton.

1952 Chevy 3100, 235ci 6cyl., 12v system


 
Marcus62c10 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 42
Marcus62c10
Age: 38
Loc: Portland Oregon
Reg: 10-06-16
03-29-17 11:06 AM - Post#2684029    
    In response to Circle.T.Farm

If it came from a car then its a 235.
The 261 was only factory installed in heavy duty trucks and buses.
cheers
-Marcus



 
Circle.T.Farm 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 51
Circle.T.Farm
Loc: Arkansas
Reg: 07-13-15
03-29-17 11:41 AM - Post#2684034    
    In response to Marcus62c10

Thanks Marcus

1952 Chevy 3100, 235ci 6cyl., 12v system


 
Circle.T.Farm 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 51
Circle.T.Farm
Loc: Arkansas
Reg: 07-13-15
04-03-17 05:27 AM - Post#2684734    
    In response to Circle.T.Farm

I went to the Auction and they didn't sell the engine seperately, The '59 Apache 1.5 Ton truck had bad rust, doors, fenders, front clip all disassembled, no bed. I was only interested in the engine. Didn't need the whole truck. Sold for 450.00

1952 Chevy 3100, 235ci 6cyl., 12v system


 
raycow 
Honored Member
Posts: 26833
raycow
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Reg: 11-26-02
04-03-17 09:08 AM - Post#2684762    
    In response to Circle.T.Farm

235 engines aren't particularly scarce, and you should be able to find one in running condition for a lot less than $450. This is because a lot of builders are pulling out good running engines in order to install a V-8. 261s are a whole other story, so you should be prepared to pay dearly when and if you can find one.

Ray

Those who choose an automatic transmission want transportation. Those who choose a manual transmission want to drive.


 
Bel Air kiwi 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 3577
Bel Air kiwi
Loc: New Zealand
Reg: 04-24-14
04-04-17 08:49 PM - Post#2685056    
    In response to raycow

Hi Circle T Farm, the easiest way to tell a genuine 261 is they have a pair of vertical lines cast into the block to identify them from the 235 block in the plants.
This long motor is a 261, It has the truck alloy timing gear and if you look on the block just below the center inlet port you will see the two vertical bars that are only on 261.
That head number is I think a standard replacement head cast as ok for both 235 /261.

The other source for a 261, apart from a US heavy truck, is a Canadian Pontiac, or an Argentinian/Brazilian pickup as they used it for another decade or so after US production stopped.

Cheers Kiwi

48 3100 RHD, 51 Deluxe 4DR RHD, 51 Bel Air parts car, 52 Bel Air P-Glide LHD. Others 23T, 32 Tudor, 58 Edsel pacer 4DR HDT, 79 F250 351C RHD. 69,70,82 Capri. No mobile, no TV, and no Jap cars.

And when it was laid to waste, they called it peace.


 
Circle.T.Farm 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 51
Circle.T.Farm
Loc: Arkansas
Reg: 07-13-15
04-06-17 06:34 AM - Post#2685226    
    In response to Bel Air kiwi

Thank you guy for the information, My engine is still doing fine, but I'll keep looking for a 261 with a head numbers ending 848. I feel it would give me the zip I'd like for my truck. I really appreciate this site and hope you information shared will help others too. Thanks, Don

1952 Chevy 3100, 235ci 6cyl., 12v system


 
Bel Air kiwi 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 3577
Bel Air kiwi
Loc: New Zealand
Reg: 04-24-14
04-07-17 08:31 PM - Post#2685532    
    In response to Circle.T.Farm

Hi Circle T, I have a 261 in an earlier pick up and I wouldn't say it gives a lot more zip. What it gives you is more torque and power, but it's probably only 5% on a 235, It revs much the same so it's not faster either.

What it will give you is enough power to change out the, (in my case 4.11:1) rear end for a 3.55:1 set which you can buy as new parts for the truck t-tube diff but not the car.

This gives you more time in each gear and a slightly higher top speed, for which you need mint steering and brakes.

To get zippy you need to go for more performance add ons and lighter parts etc. Alloy pistons, compression, dual carbs lightened flywheel, better ignition, etc. But then the engine looses economy and smoothness. Or Change out to a 292, or V8. Old original trucks are what they are.

The other direction is to go five speed behind your 235, this means you have to go open driveline but the gears will give you the pep and the od will give back the economy. Will still lok authentic under the hood.

Cheers Kiwi

48 3100 RHD, 51 Deluxe 4DR RHD, 51 Bel Air parts car, 52 Bel Air P-Glide LHD. Others 23T, 32 Tudor, 58 Edsel pacer 4DR HDT, 79 F250 351C RHD. 69,70,82 Capri. No mobile, no TV, and no Jap cars.

And when it was laid to waste, they called it peace.


Edited by Bel Air kiwi on 04-07-17 08:32 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
Circle.T.Farm 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 51
Circle.T.Farm
Loc: Arkansas
Reg: 07-13-15
04-10-17 05:29 AM - Post#2685838    
    In response to Bel Air kiwi

Thanks KIWI, I think I will stay with my 235 for now, its still a good engine. My rear end is out of a late 60"s Nova. So I have the open driveshaft. I think the gears ar 3.38
I spent this weekend installing Front Disc Brakes I ordered from Seedway Motors. I got a new master cylinder from LMC and it is giving me a problem. My old four speed transmission has the old style hand brake and the housing for it is in the way. Not sure what I'm going to do about that yet. Don


1952 Chevy 3100, 235ci 6cyl., 12v system


 
raycow 
Honored Member
Posts: 26833
raycow
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Reg: 11-26-02
04-11-17 03:34 PM - Post#2686080    
    In response to Circle.T.Farm

  • Circle.T.Farm Said:
.....I got a new master cylinder from LMC and it is giving me a problem. My old four speed transmission has the old style hand brake and the housing for it is in the way.....


Are you saying that the actual parking brake is mounted on the transmission, or that only the hand lever for the parking brake is mounted there? I know that GM used both setups at various times.

Ray

Those who choose an automatic transmission want transportation. Those who choose a manual transmission want to drive.


 
Circle.T.Farm 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 51
Circle.T.Farm
Loc: Arkansas
Reg: 07-13-15
04-12-17 05:09 AM - Post#2686170    
    In response to raycow

Yes, the emergency brake has a lever thru the floor on the right side of the transmission. The brake is mounted on rear of transmission. I did some measuring last night and the drum is about ten inches across. The speedometer cable runs thru a whole in mounting bracket on left side. I did get the cable relocated up and out of the way. I have another four speed transmission I picked up at a farm auction a year or so ago. I measured it and the drum and mounting brackets don't protrude out as far on the left side. I may try and swap them out and see if that will give me the room needed. I know the brake is not orginal equipment, because there is still the old emergency brake peddle mounted thru the floor against the left kick panel. The truck has all the emergency brake rods and spring back to where the differential is. Just missing the cables from rear brake drums. I suspect they were discarded with the rear end swap.

1952 Chevy 3100, 235ci 6cyl., 12v system


 
raycow 
Honored Member
Posts: 26833
raycow
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Reg: 11-26-02
04-12-17 07:20 PM - Post#2686351    
    In response to Circle.T.Farm

Well, I was thinking that you could remove the brake from the transmission because you already have a perfectly good parking brake setup in the rear axle. If all you need is the cables, I believe they are reproed. Check LMC, Jim Carter, Brothers, and any of the other vintage truck parts vendors that CT members might care to suggest.

Ray

Those who choose an automatic transmission want transportation. Those who choose a manual transmission want to drive.


 
Circle.T.Farm 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 51
Circle.T.Farm
Loc: Arkansas
Reg: 07-13-15
04-13-17 12:05 PM - Post#2686487    
    In response to raycow

Thanks for the the idea's Ray, it will be this weekend before I get to work on it again, I plan on trying the e-brake off the 2nd transmission and if that don't work just remove it completely. Since my differential is out of a 60's Nova I don't know if I will be able to find cables with the correct connections on both ends. I'll cross that bridge if I can't make this other brake work.

1952 Chevy 3100, 235ci 6cyl., 12v system


 
Bel Air kiwi 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 3577
Bel Air kiwi
Loc: New Zealand
Reg: 04-24-14
04-18-17 04:27 PM - Post#2687220    
    In response to raycow

Hi Guys, My NZ 48 3100 PU has the brake lever on the trans and rear wheel emergency brakes, not on the gearbox. Under the tray is a cross pipe that rotates from the lever and this pulls on individual cables to each wheel out at the chassis sides. All you need to do is connect your existing lever through cables and pulleys so that it pulls a yoke on the late model diff one piece cable. have a look at the ideas in these two diagrams and you should get a solution.

Cheers kiwi


Attachment: pickup_park_brake.gif (96.66 KB) 10 View(s)




Attachment: GT6handbreak.jpg (95.07 KB) 10 View(s)




48 3100 RHD, 51 Deluxe 4DR RHD, 51 Bel Air parts car, 52 Bel Air P-Glide LHD. Others 23T, 32 Tudor, 58 Edsel pacer 4DR HDT, 79 F250 351C RHD. 69,70,82 Capri. No mobile, no TV, and no Jap cars.

And when it was laid to waste, they called it peace.


 
Circle.T.Farm 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 51
Circle.T.Farm
Loc: Arkansas
Reg: 07-13-15
04-19-17 08:18 AM - Post#2687320    
    In response to Bel Air kiwi

Thanks Bel Air Kiwi, I have been to busy this week to take a look at it, But I find your diagrams helpful. I will crawl back under the truck and look at what I might do to correct my issue. Thanks again.

1952 Chevy 3100, 235ci 6cyl., 12v system


 
elcamino 
Dedicated Enthusiast
Posts: 5311
elcamino
Loc: Lake Superior-Michigan US...
Reg: 03-30-00
04-22-17 02:36 AM - Post#2687702    
    In response to Circle.T.Farm

Just an fyi

Con 4 means "Conveyor line #4" it was built on in the engine casting foundry.

Mike
2015 GMC Sierra Denali 6.2L(420hp)/8-sp Crew Cab Standard Box 4WD
2016 Polaris RZR 900 EPS


 
Circle.T.Farm 
"2nd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 51
Circle.T.Farm
Loc: Arkansas
Reg: 07-13-15
04-24-17 06:07 AM - Post#2688021    
    In response to elcamino

I'll copy and past this from my other post as the conversation here changed from the earlier post. I resolved the problem of the emergency brake crowding the master cylinder not allowing it to fit. I had another old 4 speed transmission that had the a e-brake drum that was smaller. I swapped out the complete system. Had to make gasket and replaced the output shaft seal at the same time. Since the old transmission had been leaking from around the top gasket I pulled the top and made a gasket for that also. Got it all back together. Just need to bleed the air from the system and I'll be driving it again.

1952 Chevy 3100, 235ci 6cyl., 12v system


 
bobschevytrucks.com Ecklers Chevy Trucks LMC Trucks
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