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Username Post: My '65 Impala SS questions thread        (Topic#342244)
chlkorg 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
06-27-17 11:54 AM - Post#2697696    
    In response to chlkorg

If I may indulge a few quick questions based upon my non-concours looks-about-right build.

1. Was the brake booster painted black or cadmium plated?

2. Are just the starter's stator housing and end cap painted black while the remainder (snout & solenoid) is in the raw?

3. Are the following items typically black - oil filler tube, all accessory's brackets and pulleys (exc. alternator fan/pulley raw?)?

4. Distributor housing and dipstick/tube - black or orange?

5. Many sites list the glass bowl fuel filter element as '55-'64. Is this simply an oversight and all glass bowl filters elements are in fact identical?

6. Anyone have experience with the Fargo Automotive weatherstripping as sold by Car Shop ( truckandcarshop.com\weatherstrip )?

Thanks!

Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


 
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427SS65 
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427SS65
Age: 71
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06-27-17 03:35 PM - Post#2697733    
    In response to chlkorg

1. Was the brake booster painted black or cadmium plated?

It is 80% black, almost flat

2. Are just the starter's stator housing and end cap painted black while the remainder (snout & solenoid) is in the raw?

Yes

3. Are the following items typically black - oil filler tube, all accessory's brackets and pulleys (exc. alternator fan/pulley raw?)?

Yes, although I have seen pictures of new engines from the Flint plant where the generator/alternator tensioner was orange

4. Distributor housing and dipstick/tube - black or orange?

Dist housing: Natural
Tube: Orange


5. Many sites list the glass bowl fuel filter element as '55-'64. Is this simply an oversight and all glass bowl filters elements are in fact identical?

My '65 327/300 has an AC glass bowl filter

6. Anyone have experience with the Fargo Automotive weatherstripping as sold by Car Shop ( truckandcarshop.com\weatherstrip )?

I don't

Tom 65-70 Full Size Team Moderator

View My Photos Here

65 Impala SS Tahitian Turquoise


 
chlkorg 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
06-27-17 04:36 PM - Post#2697747    
    In response to 427SS65

Much appreciate the info Tom! That's a few more unknowns I can now get accomplished this long weekend.

As for the fuel filter. While it looks like the paper elements are the same through the years I believe I'll place the glass bowl filter in deep storage. Beginning to think it prudent for safety sake to inline a one piece metal filter.

Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


 
bigbowtielover 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 2458
bigbowtielover
Loc: Surrey British Columbia
Reg: 09-01-13
07-01-17 02:34 PM - Post#2698306    
    In response to chlkorg

Brake booster is black if it's delco type. Moraine type is bronze cad. Oil fill tube is orange (at least in Canada) pullies on crank and water pump are grey phosphate or silver cad looking. Upper alt bracket is black and lower is orange.



 
Oshawa65SS 
Contributor
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Oshawa65SS
Age: 57
Loc: Burnaby BC Canada
Reg: 09-22-14
07-01-17 07:32 PM - Post#2698331    
    In response to bigbowtielover

Here's the black painted Canadian booster with the Bendix decal and Swan vacuum hose.



Ryan

65 Impala SS convertible 283 2V with Powerglide and 10 bolt 3.08 open
Build date Dec. 21 '64 Oshawa


 
bigbowtielover 
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bigbowtielover
Loc: Surrey British Columbia
Reg: 09-01-13
07-03-17 03:05 PM - Post#2698582    
    In response to Oshawa65SS

Bendix was also used in some US plants. All the factory moraine ones were bronze cad (or gold iridite). I have seen black ones but they were replacement units.



 
chlkorg 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
07-12-17 05:22 PM - Post#2699852    
    In response to bigbowtielover

Appreciate the additional replies!

Booster's only stamping is a 5511 on the tang, definitely a Moraine design though. I jumped the gun and painted it but not a problem as I simply didn't want to apply a finish that would stand out as non-OEM. I did strip the booster and it doesn't seem to show any sign of plating but if I understand correctly it wasn't originally a bright and shiny plate. Guess it could be a replacement but doubtful.



Over the past week I put some thought into suspension. After locating the OEM specs for the coils it's clear to see MOOG has no perfect replacement to offer. Their recommended 6192 coils have a bar diameter .026 larger, 137# greater working load and 10# greater spring rate. When I add, as most will, gas filled shocks with a built-in 20#-25# rate (not the greater 35#-70# for gas "charged" shocks) it's clear to see why so many complain about a stiff nose-high ride. This one will take a little research for sourcing.

As it might be useful for those not yet in possession of it I've added a link to a spec sheet that provides info on the above along with all other build specs for the '65 Impala/Biscayne/Bel Air.

'65 Impala AMA Spec Sheet (4.5Mb PDF)






Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


 
chlkorg 
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Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
07-25-17 11:46 AM - Post#2701392    
    In response to chlkorg

While the center console lid is not unacceptable I would like to massage her flat if at all possible. I'm assuming it's pot metal therefore probably very little that can be done with confidence to successfully straighten it. Anyone ever tackle this situation with positive results short of sourcing a new lid?





Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


 
raycow 
Honored Member
Posts: 26938
raycow
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Reg: 11-26-02
07-26-17 11:06 AM - Post#2701542    
    In response to chlkorg

Does pot metal respond to heat? I mean can pressure be applied (without breaking the part) while keeping it safely below its melting point?

Ray

Those who choose an automatic transmission want transportation. Those who choose a manual transmission want to drive.


 
chlkorg 
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Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
07-26-17 12:01 PM - Post#2701549    
    In response to raycow

  • raycow Said:
Does pot metal respond to heat? I mean can pressure be applied (without breaking the part) while keeping it safely below its melting point?

Ray


Thanks for the reply!

My understanding is that pot metal is much like your signature ("There's a line between good and evil no wider than a razor's edge.") in as much as there would, at best, be only a few degrees between malleability and melting. Was contemplating using the same method that was successful on the carb choke housing earlier in this thread. Sheepishly though, barring a tried-n-true fool-proof method of straightening, I'd be more inclined to live with the bow than chance breaking the lid.


Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


Edited by chlkorg on 07-26-17 12:25 PM. Reason for edit: Just added a few useless words. ;-)

 
bigbowtielover 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 2458
bigbowtielover
Loc: Surrey British Columbia
Reg: 09-01-13
07-27-17 06:36 AM - Post#2701633    
    In response to chlkorg

You can heat it to straighten it . I do that often to repair bent potmetal parts at the plating shop I work at. It is tricky to do.



 
chlkorg 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
07-27-17 03:49 PM - Post#2701733    
    In response to bigbowtielover

Thanks for the reply bigbowtielover.

You know I'm going to have to ask -- What might be the "trick"? Is it the heat level, rate of bending, total amount of bend, etc?

I was thinking to lay it on an open jig with screw pressure being applied evenly across the affected area. Slowly and incrementally increasing pressure while heating from below with a heat gun (or diffused torch if higher heat is required). Pretty much let it sag by itself as opposed to forcing a bend. I'm just really wary of the granular structure of this type metal and its propensity to crack.



Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


 
427SS65 
"13th Year" Platinum Supporting Member & Moderator
Posts: 14453
427SS65
Age: 71
Loc: St. Louis, MO
Reg: 12-11-03
07-27-17 11:43 PM - Post#2701790    
    In response to chlkorg

I just grabbed mine and bent it by hand. Nothing to it.

Tom 65-70 Full Size Team Moderator

View My Photos Here

65 Impala SS Tahitian Turquoise


 
vet65b 
"7th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 566
vet65b
Loc: Albuquerque, NM
Reg: 02-09-06
07-28-17 06:09 PM - Post#2701890    
    In response to 427SS65

  • 427SS65 Said:
I just grabbed mine and bent it by hand. Nothing to it.


Yes, but Tom is the luckiest guy on the DB! If I tried this the lid would wind up in ten pieces! Bill



 
chlkorg 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
07-28-17 06:41 PM - Post#2701894    
    In response to vet65b

  • vet65b Said:
Yes, but Tom is the luckiest guy on the DB! If I tried this the lid would wind up in ten pieces! Bill


I'd expect no less from a big block guy. More muscle more better.

I wish I had the guts and associated golden touch to carry that off but I'm well aware of my history of faded luck.


Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


 
chlkorg 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
07-29-17 05:19 PM - Post#2701988    
    In response to chlkorg

Mission accomplished.



Laid it on two parallel pipes with a flat backer on top. While heating the lid nice and hot using a heat gun it was slowly compressed flat by clamp. Left to cool it remained perfectly flat after removal from the jig.



Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


 
427SS65 
"13th Year" Platinum Supporting Member & Moderator
Posts: 14453
427SS65
Age: 71
Loc: St. Louis, MO
Reg: 12-11-03
07-29-17 09:44 PM - Post#2702014    
    In response to chlkorg

It's softer than you think!

Tom 65-70 Full Size Team Moderator

View My Photos Here

65 Impala SS Tahitian Turquoise


 
6T5 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 36

Age: 65
Loc: Asheville, NC
Reg: 07-22-17
08-01-17 04:31 AM - Post#2702302    
    In response to chlkorg

Good info and food for thought as mine is bowed also. Thanks for the update...



 
bigbowtielover 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 2458
bigbowtielover
Loc: Surrey British Columbia
Reg: 09-01-13
08-02-17 07:49 AM - Post#2702470    
    In response to 6T5

The spring that helps raise the lid is what makes the lid bend....and/or having too much shtuff in console and hinge gets jammed. Most of my cars have had the spring give out and door still straight but hard to open.



 
427SS65 
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Posts: 14453
427SS65
Age: 71
Loc: St. Louis, MO
Reg: 12-11-03
08-02-17 10:56 PM - Post#2702608    
    In response to bigbowtielover

Yep, broken lots of fingernails over the years!

Tom 65-70 Full Size Team Moderator

View My Photos Here

65 Impala SS Tahitian Turquoise


 
chlkorg 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
08-03-17 09:22 AM - Post#2702660    
    In response to bigbowtielover

Good info about the spring causing lid distortion, hadn't given that consideration. I did note upon initial disassembly of the console that the spring is still intact but is loose and rocks a bit, likely lessening the amount of lift (probably getting close to fingertip/fingernail torture territory). Can't recall off the top of my head but it seemed it would be a bugger to re-peen the rivets (if at all possible) to tighten up the spring mounting. Might just drill them out and add small bolts.

@6T5
I find it frustrating when I locate a thread addressing my search only to find the resolution was never disclosed (assuming there was resolution). For that reason I always attempt to follow-up with solutions insight if possible.

Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


 
427SS65 
"13th Year" Platinum Supporting Member & Moderator
Posts: 14453
427SS65
Age: 71
Loc: St. Louis, MO
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08-03-17 02:14 PM - Post#2702697    
    In response to chlkorg

I should of added that my spring was broken when I bought the car back in the early 70's. I bent mine with a slight underbow so that when the lock button is pressed, the front side of the door pops up. Of course, this is a non-permanent fix since the door tries to become flat again after time.

Tom 65-70 Full Size Team Moderator

View My Photos Here

65 Impala SS Tahitian Turquoise


 
chlkorg 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
08-04-17 06:42 AM - Post#2702769    
    In response to 427SS65

  • 427SS65 Said:
I should of added that my spring was broken when I bought the car back in the early 70's. I bent mine with a slight underbow so that when the lock button is pressed, the front side of the door pops up. Of course, this is a non-permanent fix since the door tries to become flat again after time.


That was frugal ingenuity. More cojones than I possess! On the bright side, It's likely that 40 years ago you may have been able to walk into the Chevy dealership and purchase a replacement lid if the bend went boom. Offered you opportunity to build confidence in the process. My current wariness was driven by having read that pot metal becomes even more brittle over time.

Memory comes back in small spurts -- I now recall vividly when I was driving this vehicle as a 16 year old with a new license back in '80. Clearly remember pushing down the lock with the thumb and, as you stated, digging the fingernails under the right side of the lid to get it lifted. Argh! Memories can be bitter sweet.

Again, want to thank everyone who has graciously offered insight to this thread. Guaranteed more ?'s to come.


Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


 
chlkorg 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
08-06-17 04:53 PM - Post#2703095    
    In response to chlkorg

Can't believe this info remains elusive to me -- What is the stall speed for the 327/300 PG torque converter?

I asked about the TC stall because I'm choosing the final part for the engine o-haul, the cam. I'd like to coax a bit more around town performance than the 929 grind offered while leaving all other items stock. That includes exhaust, TC, 461, 3.31, etc.

It would also be interesting to know where my calculations went wrong. Stock 327/300 bore, stroke, quench and chamber numbers has me coming up with 9.75 CR, not the 10.5 GM number.

That said -- After machining and piston selection the refreshed engine is looking to be dead-nuts 9.75 (with stock piston deck height) so I was thinking for a little something-extra cam I'd bump it to a grind similar to the Lunati Voodoo series:

Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 250/256
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 207/213
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .437/.454
LSA/ICL: 112/108
RPM Range: idle-5000

Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 256/262
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 213/219
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .454/.468
LSA/ICL: 112/108
RPM Range: 1000-5500

Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 262/268
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 219/227
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .468/.489
LSA/ICL: 112/108
RPM Range: 1400-5800

Although I'm leaning toward the 256/262 grind the TC stall will weigh heavily as a determining factor. I expect each of these should provide stock-like idle, tune and streetability (well, at least the first two cams on the list). If someone chimes in stating my targeted options are way off base, I'll go back to the drawing board.

Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


Edited by chlkorg on 08-06-17 06:17 PM. Reason for edit: Changed CR from 9.5 to 9.75

 
bigbowtielover 
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bigbowtielover
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08-11-17 08:43 PM - Post#2703831    
    In response to chlkorg

Stock V8 powerglide converter stalls at about 1400-1800 rpm. Total dog as far as performance goes. Use a converter from a 6cyl car. 11" dia and it stalls around 1800-2200 rpm. I have used them a few times with cammed up engines and it works great.



 
chlkorg 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 32

Loc: Maryland
Reg: 01-24-17
08-12-17 08:24 AM - Post#2703867    
    In response to bigbowtielover

Thanks a bunch bigbowtielover.

That's very usable info. I was pretty sure the stock TC had a relatively low stall. I also like the idea of the 6 cylinder TC swap. Aside from it hovering in what I perceive to be the sweet spot for my use it would also provide a quality OEM converter at test worthy craigslist pricing (vs Hughes new). I'm still mulling over the idea of placing the PG in storage and installing a TH350 but that would likely be at a later date.

After a bit more research I see the 10.5 CR was GM fudging the numbers, possibly for racing purposes. Since I couldn't recall the pistons I removed upon disassembly I was beginning to think maybe OEM had no valve reliefs although not sure how that would work. Would have netted a 10.5 CR assuming omission of 5cc in cuts. As is I'm tickled pink with 9.75 CR and shooting for 8-8.5 DCR.

Ej

'65 Impala SS, 327/300/PG, Madeira Maroon/Black (just getting started on stand-off resto)


 
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