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Username Post: Neutral Safety Switch location?        (Topic#313566)
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-11-14 05:43 PM - Post#2468381    

I cannot find my NSS. I have a 1955 210 265 PowerGlide. My car is stock as far as I can tell. I've looked all along the column and cannot find one that looks like the replacement.Where is it? Show me a picture please...

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 

acardon 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 10892
acardon
Loc: DFW TEXAS
Reg: 03-25-05
07-11-14 05:52 PM - Post#2468384    
    In response to 55heavychevy

Bottom of the steering column. ... Link to NSS. ...See note about installing.

Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (driving)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)


Edited by acardon on 07-11-14 05:53 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-11-14 07:11 PM - Post#2468406    
    In response to 55heavychevy

Mine is not there. I do see the purple and blue wires together. The blue hangs loose and the purple is clipped to a wire that appears to go to the ignition switch.

My car would not start in drive so where is the switch if any? .

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-11-14 07:48 PM - Post#2468415    
    In response to 55heavychevy

The real problem is the car will not start. It was fine the day before. Its acting like its in drive and so nothing to the starter. The auto shift lever was sticky so I was thinking it is the NSS. But I can't find the NSS in my car (yet). But it must be there since before the car would not start in drive. The battery seems fine. Could the starter solenoid go out just like that?

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



Edited by 55heavychevy on 07-11-14 07:53 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
romac55 
Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 77

Loc: Ontario , Canada
Reg: 12-07-11
07-12-14 05:00 AM - Post#2468465    
    In response to 55heavychevy

Using a 12-volt test-light , you can follow the signal to the start solenoid , beginning at the wire on the "S" terminal of the ignition switch . Get a helper to cycle the ignition switch to start position as you trace the start signal (or lack of it) . We often assume all owner/drivers have the same mechanical or electrical abilities , and it's just not true . It's impossible to trace a fault by eye , even on these simple old cars . Don't give up ; you can do this . Be safe...Bob.



 
acardon 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 10892
acardon
Loc: DFW TEXAS
Reg: 03-25-05
07-12-14 08:06 AM - Post#2468497    
    In response to 55heavychevy

Sounds like someone did move it if the blue wire is not attached. It could be an aftermarket switch on the transmission shift lever. It doesn't have a floor shift does it?
Does anything else not work on the car, such as the headlights or horn. Does the radio or heater work with the key on?

Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (driving)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)


 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-12-14 08:14 AM - Post#2468500    
    In response to acardon

everything else works. I clipped the 12v test light to small post on solenoid and needle end on batt ground. I the turned key and the light went on. If I cross the solenoid post with screwdriver i do get action. I cleaned the large solenoid post but not the other.

Have I narrowed down my problem to starter or no?

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
acardon 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 10892
acardon
Loc: DFW TEXAS
Reg: 03-25-05
07-12-14 09:17 AM - Post#2468508    
    In response to 55heavychevy

  • Quote:
I the turned key and the light went on. If I cross the solenoid post with screwdriver i do get action. I cleaned the large solenoid post but not the other.

Have I narrowed down my problem to starter or no?



If the starter turns when you jumper it with a screwdriver, I don't think it's the starter. Jumpering it with a screwdriver should be no different than applying voltage to the small terminal. I think you may have enough current on the small wire from the switch to light a test light but not enough to kick the solenoid. I think you may have a bad connection or a bad NSS switch as you suspected, whereever it is???


Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (driving)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)


 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-12-14 02:07 PM - Post#2468564    
    In response to romac55

Still haven't figured it out. I just cleaned the second post on the solenoid. No diff.

The light did work all the way to the solenoid as i said in my earlier post. All I have is a 12v light with pointy end. I still have not found the NSS. I saw the light go on and off when I turned the key to the far right. I have not pulled out the key switch. It looks okay behide the dash. Is the NSS under the car? Remember the purple wire is hooked, via extension, to the back of the key switch. I see no NSS switch. I did remove my steering wheel and checked the column and gave the needle indicator some oil. The linkage movement is better than before. I orig thought the poor movement of my linkage (after 2 years of sitting idle and after 20 years of sitting idle before was causing the the NSS to block ingintion jus as its behaving. But I still cant find the NSS. So its not where it supposed to be. The day before all was fine.

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-12-14 02:17 PM - Post#2468566    
    In response to 55heavychevy

btw How does a regular NSS work? In other words, what mechanism tells the NSS that the Tran lever is in the wrong place. It would to be in either the steer column or somewhere touching the linkage??? I do see in the top of steering column where 6+ wires are welded. How does that 6+ wired device interpret activity in that area such as turn signals and maybe signaling the NSS.??

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
acardon 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 10892
acardon
Loc: DFW TEXAS
Reg: 03-25-05
07-12-14 02:46 PM - Post#2468576    
    In response to 55heavychevy

The wires at the top of the column are for the turn signals and brake lights only. The NSS wiring does not go in the column. The stock NSS mounts to the column and has a tab that goes through a hole in the outer mast jacket into the shift tube. When the shift tube is in park or neutral the switch is closed. One of the terminals of the switch connects to the ignition switch and the other terminal connects to the starter. The other 2 terminals of the switch are for the back up lights and close in reverse.

  • Quote:
The blue hangs loose and the purple is clipped to a wire that appears to go to the ignition switch.




It just dawned on me. The blue wire may have been connected to the purple wire and has been acidently pulled apart. The switch should have a blue and purple wire, but if the switched were moved to the transmission under the car, they may have to be connected together.





Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (driving)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)


 
raycow 
Honored Member
Posts: 27084
raycow
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Reg: 11-26-02
07-12-14 07:48 PM - Post#2468632    
    In response to 55heavychevy

If you have stock wiring, the blue wire goes to the ignition switch and the purple wire goes to the solenoid. First, check the solenoid to make sure you have a purple wire connected there. If you do, connect the blue and purple wires together and see what happens when you turn the key to "start". Make sure the trans is in neutral or park when you do this.

Ray

Those who choose an automatic transmission want transportation. Those who choose a manual transmission want to drive.


 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-13-14 01:51 PM - Post#2468809    
    In response to raycow

Yes the purple is connected to the solenoid. It looks like the same under the dash wrapped with a blue (both are heavier gage than most under dash). I would have to believe these 2 wires were hooked up to the NSS hanging on the lower steering mask. I see the hole in the mask and now see how the NSS Works. I looked under the car near the trans linkage and do not see any electrical wires to it so I don't see a NSS. Now I should say that I 've owned this car for over 40 years (most in storage). but I don't ever recall being able to start the car while in D. The car worked the other day. I must be doing something wrong. I took The steering wheel is off to check and have not put bak on.. Will that keep the car from starting?As a kid I do remember removing the key switch at one point. btw how do you remove the key switch from the dash? Maybe there is a short?

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
acardon 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 10892
acardon
Loc: DFW TEXAS
Reg: 03-25-05
07-13-14 02:25 PM - Post#2468825    
    In response to 55heavychevy

No, the steering wheel will not keep it from starting. Have you connected the blue and purple wire together and tried to start it?
To remove the ignition lock, put it in lock with the key, insert a straightened paper clip in the small hole in the bezel. You should feel a springy button that you depress with the clip and turn the key slightly CCW and pull out the lock cylinder.




Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (driving)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)


 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-13-14 03:21 PM - Post#2468840    
    In response to acardon

I did tie the purple to the blue. No go. I popped the key switch and found that the blue wire was not connected to the switch. Instead, the purple wire is in its place (by an extension of wire). I must have rigged it that way when I was in high 40 yrs ago. I did notice that there is a connect terminal on the switch (inside) that contains 2 small pink wires. One of the pink wires had old electrician tape (the old blk fabric variety). I noticed mice droppings and tape chewed on the floor mat I pulled the tape out and disconnected one of the pink wires. The other was okay. There might have been a bad connection but now there is no connection. Could the pink wire be the problem? No NSS found yet. btw There is another wire going to the starter? What should the color be? Should that wire be traced?

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-13-14 03:33 PM - Post#2468842    
    In response to acardon

I since my last post compared the switch to google images (wow so many) and see the pink is an accessory. Prob my tape deck at the time?? All other wires look good. Still looking underneath dash. its so much easier to look without the wheel!

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
raycow 
Honored Member
Posts: 27084
raycow
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Reg: 11-26-02
07-13-14 09:00 PM - Post#2468918    
    In response to 55heavychevy

At the switch, jump the purple wire to the red wire. This may cause the engine to crank, so first make sure the trans is in park or neutral. If the engine doesn't crank, you have a break somewhere between the switch and the starter.

Ray

Those who choose an automatic transmission want transportation. Those who choose a manual transmission want to drive.


 
Bruces 57 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 2360

Reg: 01-03-07
07-14-14 02:57 AM - Post#2468937    
    In response to raycow

Hello;
I have fiddled around with the NSS on my 57 enough to tell you, if you have the stock column it goes on the column. There should be an opening where the switch can contact a tab inside the column. As I opted for a modified switch that was supposed to do the Neutral Safety as well as the back up lights. I opted not to use the screws to put mine on with, instead I used a hose clamp, this made it possibler to be able to "adjust" the switch in position to make it work as I wanted it to but somehow it didn't get everything like I wanted it. But it works in Park and Neutral, I just couldn't make it do the backup lights!
Now, if you have one of those Spiffy new tilt colums, My idea is not useable there!

Bruce



Edited by Bruces 57 on 07-14-14 02:59 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-14-14 08:04 AM - Post#2468999    
    In response to Bruces 57

The NSS is not where it should be. I guess it does not have one. I can't figure out though how all these years I could not start the car in D.

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-14-14 08:11 AM - Post#2469001    
    In response to raycow

I'll connect the red and purple when I get home. Does the key need to be in?

I see the red is the main harness. Where does the red wire go that affects the starter? If it works then what could it be?

I'm guessing it will not work. I'll see in 7 hours........

Thank you so much.

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



Edited by 55heavychevy on 07-14-14 08:26 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
acardon 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 10892
acardon
Loc: DFW TEXAS
Reg: 03-25-05
07-14-14 11:02 AM - Post#2469044    
    In response to 55heavychevy

  • Quote:
I'll connect the red and purple when I get home. Does the key need to be in?




Do not "connect" them together. Momentairly touch them together with a jumper wire. The red wire is HOT directly from the battery. The purple wire energizes the starter.

There should be a black wire from the ignition switch to the large battery terminal of the starter. It delivers battery power to the interior of the car by way of the red wire. The black and red wires are common at the switch. If the lights , ect. are working, it has power on it.
When the ignition switch is in the start position, it closes a contact between the black wire and purple wire.
You might try shorting the large battery terminal of the starter to the small purple wire terminal, with a screwdriver, to see if the starter isn't bad. If that doesn't energize it, try banging on the starter and try again. If the brushes are glaze or on a dead spot, the solenoid won't pull in.

Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (driving)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)


 
Bruces 57 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 2360

Reg: 01-03-07
07-14-14 11:42 AM - Post#2469054    
    In response to acardon

Hello;
If not located on the column, have you checked on the side of the transmission? My 32 Hot Rod has it's NSS there bolted to the side of the trans. One of those Hot Rod ad on's!

Bruce



 
Jalapeno 
Senior Member
Posts: 9661
Jalapeno
Loc: The Republic of Texas
Reg: 04-30-00
07-14-14 12:44 PM - Post#2469069    
    In response to Bruces 57

Bruce, he has a stock PG; your question leads me to think you haven't read all of the thread.

Jalapeno


 
Bruces 57 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 2360

Reg: 01-03-07
07-14-14 01:20 PM - Post#2469079    
    In response to Jalapeno

Hello;
Yes, I probly didn't read all but these days, especially if the owner was not the builder, the NSS could have been re-routed, who knows. Maybe even eliminated with a possible fused connection and the fuse no longer is good! It's anyones guess at this point unless you are under the dash looking for and seporating wires to find out just what goes where! My car was a rats nest of wire nuts and junk till I completely re-wired it from headlight to tail light!

Bruce



 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-14-14 04:33 PM - Post#2469134    
    In response to raycow

At the switch, I just connected the purple wire tab to the red tab using a 12 v light. The light worked. The, using regular wire I get sparks but nothing to the starter. My wires are still in their original wraps (and so the wire cannot be seen in most places) looking in good condition. Under the dash is not bad either. I'll have to look at the trans again for wires/NSS. Is the conclusion that the purple wire is shorting out somewhere between the ign switch and the solenoid? Let me go see again.

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
acardon 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 10892
acardon
Loc: DFW TEXAS
Reg: 03-25-05
07-14-14 04:57 PM - Post#2469143    
    In response to 55heavychevy

  • Quote:
Is the conclusion that the purple wire is shorting out somewhere between the ign switch and the solenoid?



I don't think so. You can expect a spark when you jumper the 2 together. The solenoid draws a lot of current. I think your starter is bad. Did you try jumpering the battery cable terminal of the starter to the small purple wire terminal? That should engage the starter regardless of a wiring problem.

Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (driving)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)


 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-14-14 05:09 PM - Post#2469144    
    In response to acardon

what exactly should it do? It sparks. Can it be held for more than a second?

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-14-14 05:13 PM - Post#2469145    
    In response to acardon

Also, I can see 95% of the purple and blk wires go to and from the ignit to the battery. All of which is blak taped. So unless the wire connection at the starter is faulty. I checked it once and cleaned it. Its a bit brittle but has worked before.

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 
acardon 
Ultra Senior Member
Posts: 10892
acardon
Loc: DFW TEXAS
Reg: 03-25-05
07-14-14 06:21 PM - Post#2469160    
    In response to 55heavychevy

  • Quote:
what exactly should it do? It sparks. Can it be held for more than a second?



You can hold it for a few seconds. The starter should engage and start cranking the engine.


Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (driving)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)


 
55heavychevy 
Contributor
Posts: 177
55heavychevy
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 06-25-08
07-14-14 07:22 PM - Post#2469171    
    In response to acardon

I tried that and yes the engine cranked slowly almost nothing - like a dead battery. I put the charger on it and will try again in the morning. The battery is a Delco about 4 years old but not used for 1 1/2years. I charged it last week and it did start. Maybe its not holding a charge. I tried my back up battery but it too has sat and needs a charge. I was assuming that since the lights ect work and the charging light showed complete that my bat was good enough for a crank. I'll try in the morning hoping that the battery is crap. Then I can move on. btw I did not see any stress/cuts or any openings on the blk and purp wires going from the ignit switch to the starter. wire, to

1955 Red/White Delray Club Coupe

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL269/11357194/2034...



 

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