 Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2207
Loc: Simi Valley CA
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08-12-12 02:40 PM - Post#2258523
I asked a similar question before and I am still running around confused as heck.
System:
Classic Auto A/C
Trinary switch (Classic Auto)
Dakota Digital PAC 2000 2 fan controller.
Two Spal fans...each with its own relay to switch in power from a shared +12 v feed.
I can not visualize how I connect the fan power relays back to the trinary switch (A/C Fan Switch??), then to the A/C unit finally ending at the fan controller which will signal the fan relays to power up base on what the signal the temp sensor sends direct to the PAC.
Second question: is the trinary the "A/C clutch switch" or is it a different switch in the A/C unit itself?
A hand drawing would be really great if possible.
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 Rick_L
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Loc: Katy, Tx, USA
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08-12-12 05:08 PM - Post#2258584
In response to Big T
First, the trinary switch is not the "clutch comppressor switch".
Do you have a separate relay for each fan? How is the DD controller wired? Does it turn both fans on when the controller signals it? Does it turn ond fan one at a low setting and another at a higher setting? Or is it wired to do both fans, half speed at a lower setting and full speed at a higher setting?
I am going to assume that you have two fan relays, and that either both come on or one comes on at a lower setting.
If this is the case, you need to wire the trinary switch this way: To operate the fan, the controller is going to ground one of the relay contacts. Run two wires from one terminal of the trinary switch, one to each relay, to the same terminal as the one that connects to the controller. Run a wire from the other terminal of the trinary switch to ground.
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 acardon
"9th Year" Silver Supporting Member
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08-12-12 05:38 PM - Post#2258592
In response to Rick_L
Run two wires from one terminal of the trinary switch, one to each relay, to the same terminal as the one that connects to the controller.
Rick, you can't connect 1 terminal of both relays together to the trinary switch or they will both energize when either one is energized.
The PAC has a fan input that requires a 12 volt input. It will turn both fans on. Connect one blue wire of the trinary switch to the A/C terminal of the PAC. Connect the other blue wire of the tirnary to switched 12 volts. Connect one black wire of the binary switch to the blue wire from the evaporaor. Connect the other black wire of the binary to the compressor.
Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (restoring)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)
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Rick_L
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08-13-12 04:56 AM - Post#2258686
In response to acardon
"Rick, you can't connect 1 terminal of both relays together to the trinary switch or they will both energize when either one is energized."
That's what you want when the trinary switch closes. At least what I want. Hence my reply.
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acardon
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08-13-12 07:21 AM - Post#2258727
In response to Rick_L
That's what you want when the trinary switch closes. At least what I want. Hence my reply.
But if you connect the ground terminal of both relays together at the trinary wire, when the low temp sensor goes to ground, it will also take the high temp relay to ground and both fans will run. You could seperate the ground terminals of the relays with diodes and connect them together at the trinary switch wire.
Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (restoring)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)
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Rick_L
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08-13-12 02:02 PM - Post#2258864
In response to acardon
Ok, I see now.
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Big T
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08-13-12 02:16 PM - Post#2258869
In response to Rick_L
Hi Rick and Don.
Yes there is one relay for each fan. The PAC 2000 controller has two separate signal outputs. One for lo fan and one for Hi fan.
When the programed lo fan temp is sensed, one fan will kick on (full rpm). When the programed upper temp limit is sensed, the hi fan will kick on (full rpm).....both fans now running. As it cools down the reverse happens.
Rick what and where am I looking to identify the clutch switch????
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acardon
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08-13-12 03:42 PM - Post#2258909
In response to Big T
There are 2 seperate switches in a trinary switch, one for the fan and 1 for the clutch. The trinary switch I got from Classic Auto Air has 4 wires. The 2 blue wires are for the fan control and the 2 black wires are for the compressor clutch. One of the black wires goes to the clutch and the other to the blue wire from the evaporator compressor control.
Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (restoring)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)
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bihili
Senior Member
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08-14-12 09:41 AM - Post#2259141
In response to Big T
I think this is correct. Don or Rick correct this if it is wrong.
Show Me
1957-427-177-6-410 |
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acardon
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08-14-12 10:16 AM - Post#2259153
In response to bihili
That looks good, Bihili. 
Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (restoring)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
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Loc: Simi Valley CA
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08-14-12 07:11 PM - Post#2259357
In response to bihili
Thanks Bill and Don
I am a lot better with pictures (to many playboys when I was a kid...didn't need to read) 
Rick mentioned that the Trinary and the A/C switch are not the same switch. According to DD instructions the A/C is connected to the A/C switch.
Sooooo your great drawing (thank you again) appears to show that one side of the trinary switch is going to the DD A/C terminal
Am I still turned around on A/C switch vs Trinary switch (one side only)
Oh!!!! I just looked at your drawing again. Is the A/C thermostat also the A/C switch Rick is talking about? If this is correct, it sends a signal back through the trinary to the A/C switch and turns on both fans when the A/C is on. A/C is off, the engine temp sensor runs the fans. Yes?
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Rick_L
Honored Member
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08-14-12 07:30 PM - Post#2259372
In response to Big T
The trinary switch has 3 functions (hence its name).
1. Shuts off the compressor when the pressure is too low (way undercharged or giant leak).
2. Shuts off the compressor when the pressure is too high (way overcharged, or blockage in the high pressure side).
3. Runs the fan(s) if the high side pressure is above the set point.
The wiring for 1. and 2. is combined, as shown in the diagram above. These are safety switches, when everything is normal, power goes to the compressor clutch and the system runs.
3. is totally separate as shown.
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bihili
Senior Member
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08-15-12 07:49 AM - Post#2259538
In response to Big T
The AC Thermostat wire on my chart is a black wire which connects to a Blue wire coming from you Classic Air evaporator.
I also have Classic Air.
You Asked: (A/C is off, the engine temp sensor runs the fans. Yes?)
Yes.
Show Me
1957-427-177-6-410 |
Edited by bihili on 08-15-12 07:55 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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acardon
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08-15-12 09:11 AM - Post#2259563
In response to bihili
Am I still turned around on A/C switch vs Trinary switch (one side only)
Oh!!!! I just looked at your drawing again. Is the A/C thermostat also the A/C switch Rick is talking about? If this is correct, it sends a signal back through the trinary to the A/C switch and turns on both fans when the A/C is on. A/C is off, the engine temp sensor runs the fans. Yes?
Tom, I think the part that is confusing is DD instructions do not show the use of a trinary switch. When using a trinary switch, the trinary switch (blue wires) takes the place of the "A/C cycle switch" in the DD instructions. Notice in the drawing that one of the trinary blue wires is connected to switched 12 volts. When the trinary switch closes, when the pressure is high enough to require more air flow, it sends 12 volts to the DD controller A/C input to turn the fans on.
The binary part of the trinary switch (black wires) is the safety switch in the compressor clutch circuit.
P.S. You can use the same wire used for the switched 12 volts going to the DD PAC for the switched 12 volts to the trinary switch blue wire.
Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (restoring)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2207
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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08-15-12 04:09 PM - Post#2259707
In response to Rick_L
Thanks Bill, Rick and Don.
I really appreciate all of your time in helping me understand what is probably a very simple thing for most.
Thanks again
Tom
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2207
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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08-17-12 01:35 PM - Post#2260338
In response to Big T
I just can't leave things alone until it is researched to death.
The following refers to the drawing above.
INFO #1: I contacted DD and was told that the Trinary is not directly hooked to the A/C (clutch input terminal) on the PAC 2000 but I should tap into the power wire that turns the A/C on. I have the BelAir control head,, so I should be able to tap into the last blower position which now turns on a/c. Yes??
INFO #2: I also called Classic Auto Air. The people I bought the A/c and trinary switch from.
Using the above drawing again, CA told me that one blue wire goes directly to the A/C terminal on the PAC 2000. The other trinary blue wire goes to "ground". One black wire goes to the clutch switch on the compressor and the other black wire goes to the A/C switch which they said is on the evaporator ( top of the A/C unit by the blower fan and thermostat). Would this not be the same as tapping into the A/C power out as in the DD info above?
What do y'all get out of this info so I can hook the darn thing up without burning things up and move on.
Thanks guys
Tom
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acardon
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Loc: DFW TEXAS
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08-17-12 03:05 PM - Post#2260355
In response to Big T
It sounds like DD wants you to bypass the trinary switch by hooking the A/C inout of the PAC directly to a 12 volt source when A/C switch is on.
CAA won't work because the DD requires 12 volts to the A/C input of the PAC and not ground. Look at the signal list in the instructions.
Don
66 Corvair (driving)
57 2dr HT (restoring)
56 2dr HT (waiting to be restored)
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2207
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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08-17-12 03:36 PM - Post#2260358
In response to acardon
Thanks Don for looking it over for me.
The minute I heard "ground", a caution light turned on.
Tom .
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