 Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2206
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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07-30-12 12:34 PM - Post#2253777
Info Only
I was not aware of this product and perhaps others aren't either. My #5 plug boot sits dead center and makes contact with the back of this tube (Patriot 8025 headers).
Accel (and maybe otherss....not researched)make a ceramic plug boot and sells it in a kit form with 8mm spiral wound wire. Cheapest price I have found so far is Amazon at $112.00.
According to Accel, their plug boot can sit in direct contact with the header tube, and withstand heat up to 2000*F. The boots where designed to work with Accel shortie plugs with this problem in mind.
Boots come in straight, 90* and 115*
This sure works for me.
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 larrybrowningmauldin
"4th Year" Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 373
Loc: New Braunfels,TX
Reg: 08-16-05
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07-30-12 03:27 PM - Post#2253856
In response to Big T
I do not know the answer; however, I do know how to make the sign for degrees . Hold down the ALT key and type 167. Release ALT. Like this 190º
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MikeB
Senior Member
Posts: 9388
Loc: Plano, TX
Reg: 08-28-03
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07-30-12 05:40 PM - Post#2253920
In response to Big T
T -- Are you saying you still have the problem with shorter plugs? If you get the boots, let us know how they work.
Real Hot Rods have a Clutch!
1955 210 2dr: 327, Brodix IK180 heads, Jones cam, Muncie M20, Wilwood front brakes
1969 C-10 pickup: 350, TH350
My car pictures
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Edited by MikeB on 07-30-12 05:42 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2206
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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07-30-12 06:34 PM - Post#2253953
In response to larrybrowningmauldin
Hey Larry
Thanks for the tips. Always wondered how to do that.
Tom
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2206
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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07-30-12 07:48 PM - Post#2254006
In response to MikeB
Hi Mike
I am using Patriot 8050 (been awhile maybe they are 8025 3/4 length.
Not sure but maybe the off-set between the heads has something to do with this problem.
#1,3 and 7 have enough room to allow for the recommended stock plug and boot but adding a sock would be a good idea IMO. the boots are all close on this side with #5 being absolutely impossible. The other side looks super. All the wires lay in like they should...plenty of room.
I hope a set of shorties with these ceramic 90 degree boots do the trick. Otherwise I will have to buy another set of headers. Ouch!!!!!
As soon as I buy and install the boots and wires, I will give you a update.
Tom
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55 Shaker
Member
Posts: 1043
Age: 63
Loc: north central IL.
Reg: 03-13-06
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07-31-12 10:54 AM - Post#2254181
In response to Big T
Could you double the header gaskets, or find a thicker header gasket that goes between the head and the header? Maybe that'll buy you some extra clearence. Just a thought.
| The older I get, the more dangerous, I am !!!! |
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2206
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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07-31-12 07:34 PM - Post#2254323
In response to 55 Shaker
Hi Shaker
I thought about having a metal spacer made for that side, but the number 5 tube would run into the 500 steering box on the other side.
Good idea for the other side, but I am afraid I still need to think more on these ceramic boots. We'll see.
Thanks for the input, it was a good idea.
Tom
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Belair56OKC
Contributor
Posts: 121
Age: 57
Loc: Edmond, OK
Reg: 09-28-11
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08-02-12 12:27 PM - Post#2254966
In response to 55 Shaker
BigT, I wrapped my boots with some old aircraft engine fire proof tape I had on hand and that even discolored and fell off. I was kind of doing some R&D and playing around with different fixes. Keep at it and look forward to a sucessful fix. Enjoy  Russ
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2206
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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08-03-12 11:32 AM - Post#2255362
In response to Belair56OKC
Hi Russ
It is amazing that the tape didn't work.....at all.
Does that stuff have a shelf life?
Thanks for the support. Buying the Ceramic wire boots is next on my list....hope it takes care of my concerns. Not sure there is much to do after that other than buy new heads that are known to work.
Tom
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 OLKY55
Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 234
Loc: Fulshear, TX
Reg: 09-18-05
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08-03-12 11:36 AM - Post#2255368
In response to Big T
On my big-block, I found that NGK plugs were 3/8" shorter than the Accel shorties.
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2206
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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08-03-12 07:20 PM - Post#2255480
In response to OLKY55
Thanks olky. I am going to check that out and hope it holds true for the small block I have.
I know that the one Accel shortie I bought, gave me just enough room behind the header tube to get the rubber boot on with a little room left over.
To gain another 3/8 inch would be super.
Thanks again
Tom
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Belair56OKC
Contributor
Posts: 121
Age: 57
Loc: Edmond, OK
Reg: 09-28-11
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08-04-12 01:51 PM - Post#2255690
In response to Big T
Hi Tom,
The airplane tape was close to 20 years old..I wrapped the started harness and then installed some silver alum. fiberglass lined sleeving from Summit which worked pretty good. I used this airplane engine tape during the initial built up back in 1992 and wrapped a bunch of hard to reach harnesses. It stayed together and prevented many issues with the heat and chaffing. I just had the old roll and said maybe this will still work on the plug boot burn thru issue. The plug wires I tried were the Accel ceramic straights. I tried these big sock / extra boot looking things but they looked like dog meat and were still resting against the header. I currently have the engine on a stand with headers on the engine and am playing with plug wire and boot position prior to sending them to ceramic coat. When I drop this engine in the old Chevy hopefully all the top stuff will be in place and secured. Hanging over the old Chevy fenders and putting things together is no walk in the park for this older guy. Planning ahead saves the OLD back. Enjoy and keep in touch. Russ
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2206
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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08-05-12 10:38 AM - Post#2255982
In response to Belair56OKC
Thanks Russ for the details.
I am one of the youngsters on this site. It has been a bit more than awhile, but if I think real hard I might remember something from my 57th year of life.
Understand the back problem I have my padded creeper for under the car, my roll around stool for things closer to the ground, jack stands so I can raise the car and lean against the fenders instead of over them it and the seats are out so I can lay down working under the dash. I like the lay down part the best.
Lifting.....no problem. Have a couple of strong kids next door that do it for me.
My only concern is that I need to finish this car now while my knees are good enough to still push down the clutch.
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WagonCrazy
"7th Year" Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 2314
Loc: So Cal
Reg: 06-07-05
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08-07-12 01:15 PM - Post#2256818
In response to Big T
Tom, here's my setup:
Patriot Shorty headers
Accel shorty plugs
8mm plug wires with 90 degree ceramic boots
In this pic, #1 and #7 cylinder wires are rounted under the header collector, and #3 and #5 go over the headers. The header pipes are very tight near the plug tips, and with the 90 degree boots, #3 and #5 cannot be routed under the headers or they will burn up the wires. So they got put over and away from the heat...
Here's a closeup of #3 boot. Notice you can barely slip a feeler gauge between the end of the boot and the header...
On the passenger side, All plug wires are rounted under the header collector. Some have that silver heat protector sleeve material over then, because they still pass close to the headers. You'll also notice everything else close to the headers wrapped up in that heat shield material. Starter wires expecially...extra heated wires are notorious for adding electrical resistance when starting. I noticed all kinds of heat related issues (that were resolved with this wrap) when I switched from the old stock manifolds to these shorty headers.
The plug wire kit (with the ceramic boots) was a cut-to-fit style kit, so I trimmed each wire to fit snugly against the block...away from header collectors and heat. With plug wires all coming up from the bottom-rear to the distributor cap, I put a set of plastic plug wire numbers on each wire so that when I pulled 'em from the cap, I easily knew where to put them back.
This set up has served me well for over 3 years now, with nothing burning up.
All the other stuff (rubber boots, socks, etc) was burning up... 
You can get all this stuff at Summit... 
57 Nomad C4-LS1 Pics
57 210 9passenger wagon Pics |
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MikeB
Senior Member
Posts: 9388
Loc: Plano, TX
Reg: 08-28-03
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08-07-12 01:35 PM - Post#2256827
In response to WagonCrazy
You gotta wonder about header companies. It's bad enough when their products hit the frame, steering box, or Pitman arm, but you'd think it would be fairly easy to check clearance on an engine with a few different types of cylinder heads. 
Real Hot Rods have a Clutch!
1955 210 2dr: 327, Brodix IK180 heads, Jones cam, Muncie M20, Wilwood front brakes
1969 C-10 pickup: 350, TH350
My car pictures
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Edited by MikeB on 08-07-12 01:37 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2206
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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08-09-12 03:53 PM - Post#2257654
In response to WagonCrazy
Hi Paul, thanks for all the great pictures.
Currently I am bringing the wires over the top through a billet loom. Passanger side, great no problems.
I am hoping the ceramic booth help the other side. All the wires are in the "other" billet loom and drop down to the plugs without issue, except number 3 and 5
I need to sit down and experiment with the routing. But whatever I end up with, I'm going to use the ceramic boots.
Thanks again
Tom
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Big T
"7th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 2206
Loc: Simi Valley CA
Reg: 04-14-06
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08-09-12 04:06 PM - Post#2257662
In response to MikeB
Hi Mike
At what point does the price top out to get anything to work right.
During my working years, I was stuffed into a white shirt and tie for ever.
Always had buttons popping off. Always wondered how must more it would cost me to buy a shirt that didn't have that problem.
Fortunately the time came when golf shirts where acceptable attire. The buttons still popped off, but at least my navel wasn't hanging out flashing everyone. 
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