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Username Post: Electric fan/water pump - REAL dyno gains?        (Topic#225232)
Number21 
Senior Member
Posts: 811
Number21
Loc: OR
Reg: 02-01-05
09-04-09 07:25 PM - Post#1766598    

I'm interested in replacing the mechanical fan and water pump on my truck with a stock 350 - the fan that's there now looks like it could be used as a propeller on an airplane! While I'm at it I thought I might replace the water pump with an electric one too.

Looking at aftermarket pumps and fans at places like Jegs they all claim like 15-20HP increases. I know I'll get something, but I doubt 40hp is going to my fan and water pump!

I'm just wondering if anybody has any REAL dyno numbers for switching to electric accessories? The only thing left attached by belts would be the alt and PS pump.

 
N8sToolz 
Very Senior Member
Posts: 2315
N8sToolz
Age: 28
Loc: N 42┬░ 53.290' W71┬░ 34.1...
Reg: 10-23-03
09-04-09 08:06 PM - Post#1766625    
    In response to Number21

I dont think theres any practical gains from it, especially where you still have a PS and ALt connected to it, the energy is still bein used to move water, just being pulled from the alt.

Most of the time when I see those set up its a drag car and they arent running anything else, just recharge the batt each time, trying to milk any bit of power they get.

The fan draws much more energy from the motor than anything else, electric fans are a very popular conversion.
1982 Chevy K20 Converted from C20.
355/700R4
2002 Yamaha XVS1100CL VStar
2002 S10 2WD


 
Number21 
Senior Member
Posts: 811
Number21
Loc: OR
Reg: 02-01-05
09-04-09 09:08 PM - Post#1766651    
    In response to N8sToolz

The thing about electric water pumps (and fans) is that they are designed to, and run at a fixed RPM. The stock water pump is designed to pump X amount of water at cruising speed, and WAY more than you need if you stomp on it and hit 5500.

 
IgnitionMan 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 2664

Reg: 04-15-05
09-05-09 08:36 AM - Post#1766795    
    In response to Number21

Dyno/shmyno, when you rip that mechanical stuff off the engine, can I have it? I'll put it to good use, properly cooling another engine.

 
52chevybob 
Dedicated Enthusiast
Posts: 5628

Reg: 05-27-08
09-05-09 12:31 PM - Post#1766901    
    In response to IgnitionMan

I don't know how much HP can be delivered to a fan pulley but it can't be much. My 283 has about that much of an angle where the fan belt is hitting the waterpump pulley and it doesn't slip so I figure a half HP or so is what it is transmitting at the max. If I put the pump and fan on a 1/4HP electric motor it will probably pumpt just fine at speeds as fast as the engine would at 6K rpm.

 
Raven18940 
Member
Posts: 272

Reg: 09-22-04
09-08-09 06:30 AM - Post#1768107    
    In response to 52chevybob

If you spend a lot of time in the upper RPM range, you'll see a gain from a electric fan. The electric water pump not so much.


 
Johnny468 
"6th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 595
Johnny468
Loc: Richmond, Va.
Reg: 10-24-08
09-08-09 09:55 AM - Post#1768197    
    In response to Raven18940

When I converted my mildly built street/strip 327 from a mechanical fan to electric fans, there was a noticable seat-of-the-pants increase in power. I must qualify this statement by saying it was a fixed type fan, not a clutch fan. It was the dead of winter and I decided I would just remove the fan completely from the engine and run around the neighborhood to see if I could tell a difference. I was very skeptical of the horsepower claims made concerning electric fans, but after that short trip, I was sold on the idea. I could feel a difference as soon as I pulled out of my driveway. I don't think 10 horsepower is an unrealistic estimate of the power gain I realized.

As far as electric water pumps go, that's strictly race car stuff. Stick to a good mechanical pump for a street car.

Johnny
1965 Impala SS
505/4-speed/4.30


 
D.Mac 
Senior Member
Posts: 997

Loc: Ontario Canada
Reg: 03-22-03
09-08-09 11:22 AM - Post#1768229    
    In response to Johnny468

Well I wouldn't say "strictly" race car stuff, but I understand peoples reservation about them.
I been running an electric pump for 5 years now with no issues. But LT1's don't have a belt driven pump to begin with. It's driven off of the cam. It's a common, easy and convienient conversion to electric.
Dave MacDonald
Ontario, Canada

'66 Impala LT1/C950-,EFI,700R4,(sold 07/2011)
'12 Sonic LTZ, Turbo, M6
'07 Pontiac Solstice GXP
'06 Caddy CTS-V


 
C10 Sleeper 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 3426
C10 Sleeper
Loc: Redding Ca
Reg: 03-17-09
09-08-09 11:26 AM - Post#1768232    
    In response to Johnny468

  • Quote:
As far as electric water pumps go, that's strictly race car stuff. Stick to a good mechanical pump for a street car.




I agree with that. Also as far as the fan goes I have a set of electric fans on my truck and love how they work. By the time you spend the money converting over to an electric water pump and fan set up and buying a good quality alternator to run them you would be far better off up grading something else for more power rather than trying to free up the power you are allready making on a street truck. With out knowing all the modifcations you have allready made my opinion is not to waste your money. The electric fan up grade is nice but not really a neceissity.
http://photobucket.com/C10Pictures


 
Johnny468 
"6th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 595
Johnny468
Loc: Richmond, Va.
Reg: 10-24-08
09-08-09 11:50 AM - Post#1768241    
    In response to D.Mac

D Mac, that's a tastefully executed and super-clean looking mill you have there. Very nice!

Johnny
1965 Impala SS
505/4-speed/4.30


 
52chevybob 
Dedicated Enthusiast
Posts: 5628

Reg: 05-27-08
09-08-09 02:45 PM - Post#1768351    
    In response to Johnny468

I'd not believe any results of more power until somebody does a dyno test on an engine with and without a fan and waterpump. I'm runnig a large flexfan on my '52 with 283 in it and there isn't just enough belt wrap to provide anymore than maybe a half HP at the best.
I'll also note that big HP gains can't be with alternators not running as a stock 63A alternator is only putting out 1HP of electrical energy - where is all the rest of the HP going?

 
C10 Sleeper 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 3426
C10 Sleeper
Loc: Redding Ca
Reg: 03-17-09
09-08-09 03:12 PM - Post#1768366    
    In response to 52chevybob

I wouldnt call it gaining HP more like freeing up what you allready have. I can see a large fan with out a clutch eating up some HP but not enough to worry about on the street. Years ago when I was racing stock cars in a class with pretty strict rules I had my car on a dyno. Its been about 5 years ago so I dont remember the exact numbers. I do remember there was about a 4 HP gain at the rear wheels by not running the alternator. On the race track racing in a class with strict rules limiting what you can and cant have on or in your motor we were looking for any gain big or small in as many places as possible. My car was very competetive obviously because we did alot of little things that added up by reducing rotating mass and loosing as much weight as possible. Like I allready mentioned is it worth it for a street only vehicle? Probably not. By the time you spend $500+ dollars on a good elect fan, water pump set up you would probably be better off buying something like intake manifold and cam kit or up grading the exhuast system for the same or better results.
http://photobucket.com/C10Pictures


 
Jim.Biron 
"7th Year" Platinum Supporting Member
Posts: 2483
Jim.Biron
Age: 63
Loc: Saugerties, NY
Reg: 04-10-08
09-09-09 08:22 AM - Post#1768836    
    In response to Johnny468

  • Johnny468 Said:
D Mac, that's a tastefully executed and super-clean looking mill you have there. Very nice!

Johnny




If they only made that for a big block with a std, short, water pump. It's just what I an looking for.
Jim
www.HudsonValleyCruise.com


 
52chevybob 
Dedicated Enthusiast
Posts: 5628

Reg: 05-27-08
09-09-09 02:22 PM - Post#1769031    
    In response to C10 Sleeper

I'd consider 4HP for an alt. to be extremely lossy! As I said, the 63A stock alt. is putting out about 1HP of power. That would make the generation of the power to be about 25% efficient from the crankshaft. I would have expected about 10% loss, not 400% loss. Then again, with the amount of power and so forth, the errors in getting an actual HP gain from one pair of runs, this would pretty much be normal for the error tolerance.

 
C10 Sleeper 
Valued Contributor
Posts: 3426
C10 Sleeper
Loc: Redding Ca
Reg: 03-17-09
09-09-09 02:54 PM - Post#1769052    
    In response to 52chevybob

Keep in mind that was 4 HP at the rear wheels not the crank. Also it was powering 2 8 inch electric fans for the radiator and a 6 inch fan for an oil cooler. Either way it had a pretty good load on it. Also the alt was 100 amp unit. Not sure how the results would change if running on an engine dyno rather than a dyno that measures from the rear wheels. If it was measured at the crank I am sure it would have shown it used less HP. I also know that dyno wizardry can be quite biased depending on what and or if the operator is trying to sell. All in all it was a few years ago and I cant remember every little detail.
http://photobucket.com/C10Pictures


 
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