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LMC Truck



 Page 1 of 2 12
Username Post: Poppets to MPFI conversion -4.3s - 96+engines        (Topic#148720)
DeLong 
Banned Member
Posts: 2868

Loc: Rural Illinois
Reg: 06-06-02
01-13-07 07:26 AM - Post#1070509    

I used the gm mfi spider to convert my 97 jimmy from CSFI. I used the following parts:

MFI spider #12568332
Upper plenium Seal Kit #17113215
All parts I used were GM but Napa makes a kit too.

The reason for conversion is the truck was idling rough and hard to start.Truck has 98k. To replace with the original cfsi parts the poppets and regulator was double the price of the upgraded spider.
I was advised to get a bracket #88894355 but didnt and I was able to reuse the one on the vehicle.
It was also a good time to replace the cap and rotor since all the stuff was out of the way.

The truck has never run better. Smooth idle and better throttle response.

Added 4/14/13
Poor man way to clean injectors.
http://www.instructables.com/id/Poor-Mans-Repair-G ...
Tools needed:
1. Carb Cleaner
2.Sea Foam in a can "Deep Creep"
3. A Pot O Boil'in Water and or a Heat Gun "Heat gun is faster but water is safer"
4. A Few pairs of needle nose pliers
5. An air compressor with blow gun.

The above procedure was found by a Internet search. Use at your own risk.


00 Yukon SLT XL 5.3
98 Lumina Police Package 3.8
88 2500 4X4 5.7
87 Mustang LX 5.0
67 Mustang Fastback 289
65 Mustang Fastback 289


Edited by gchemist on 04-14-13 06:12 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
LMC Trucks
ExtraScrews 
Senior Member
Posts: 284

Loc: Kansas, USA
Reg: 08-19-04
01-13-07 08:14 AM - Post#1070532    
    In response to DeLong

Is the original intake manifold still in place? What year engine are the new components native to?

I have often wondered about the system used on marine/industrial 4.3's, but not the conversion you performed.

1995 S10 (4.3 5-speed)

What is your malfunction?


 
DeLong 
Banned Member
Posts: 2868

Loc: Rural Illinois
Reg: 06-06-02
01-13-07 03:18 PM - Post#1070765    
    In response to ExtraScrews

I dont know what the year the MFI became standard for 4.3s. Yes the lower intake stayed on the truck. The only thing you have to remove is the plastic upper plenium.You reuse that. Be careful bolting it down. Since its plastic it wont take much torque. Its what the throttle body is sitting on.

00 Yukon SLT XL 5.3
98 Lumina Police Package 3.8
88 2500 4X4 5.7
87 Mustang LX 5.0
67 Mustang Fastback 289
65 Mustang Fastback 289


 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
01-13-07 05:22 PM - Post#1070852    
    In response to DeLong

Interesting. I'm having the similiar problems with my 96. My Jimmy hates the cold weather. I constantly get multiple or #6 cylinder misfire. I've done a complete tune up on it so I'm thinging the CFI is messed up. Did you take any pictures? What did you do about the fuel regulator? Any other minor details available?
I know that if I plan to keep my Jimmy for a long time, I'll have to replace or upgrade the poppets.

'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
Cramil 
Member
Posts: 87

Reg: 09-09-02
01-13-07 08:01 PM - Post#1070950    
    In response to DeLong

I'm just curious, didn't you say this truck has TBI? If it is how were you able to convert it to MFI? What does CSFI mean? Were you able to take care of that oil/transmission fluid leak?



 
DeLong 
Banned Member
Posts: 2868

Loc: Rural Illinois
Reg: 06-06-02
01-13-07 09:15 PM - Post#1071001    
    In response to Cramil

My old 96 z71 1500 5.7 had multiple misfires too. That one got the mfi conversion and that was the end of the misfires.

I didnt take any pictures,which in hindsite was stupid.Sorry.

I did a complete tune up on this one too including a fuel pump,which it actually needed, before fixing the injectors .

The fuel regulator is part of the mfi spider. The upgraded spider was a lot cheaper than buying a new regulator and 6 replacement poppets.

I did say the truck was tbi but I was ignorant of the different types of injection. 92-95 have Central Port Injection. 96-03 have Central Sequential Fuel Injection if the Vin has a "W" and RPO-L35 . This improvement is only good for 96-03 trucks.

http://forums.s-series.org/viewtopic.php?t=12717

A few details: The hoses for a couple cylinders seem too long so you have to put loops in them. The loops cant stick up very high or the intake wont go back on. Run the injectors for the two cylinders closest to the firewall towards the back of the truck and loop them toward the front then into the cylinders. The other 4 injectors need to run towards the front of the truck.Click the body of the spider into the bracket before putting the injectors in the cylinder holes.

Put a little grease on the hole that the body of the spider goes through on the upper plenium.It is a VERY tight fit. I couldnt get it all the way through plenium without the grease.

I cleaned the IAC while the plenium was off as Cramil suggested in a previous post.Thanks

Edit-The oil leak is minor. I dumped some dye into the oil and will track it with a black light in a while. I cant do too much at once.

00 Yukon SLT XL 5.3
98 Lumina Police Package 3.8
88 2500 4X4 5.7
87 Mustang LX 5.0
67 Mustang Fastback 289
65 Mustang Fastback 289


Edited by DeLong on 01-13-07 09:19 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
01-14-07 03:23 AM - Post#1071070    
    In response to DeLong

Next question. How long does the job take? I have my other truck out of commission, blew the timing chain which killed the motor. If I can do it in a couple of hours, I may do it quickly. My scanner is getting plenty of use now. The SES light goes out if I start/turn off the engine enough times during the day. I hate the hesitation that is part of the problem.

'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
DeLong 
Banned Member
Posts: 2868

Loc: Rural Illinois
Reg: 06-06-02
01-14-07 06:08 AM - Post#1071123    
    In response to gchemist

I was told 2 hours by a guy on a different forum but it took me 5. I take the time to label and bag bolts plus I clean everything while its off.I also did a cap/rotor/fan belt. I had never worked on this jimmy to this extent so I wasnt familiar with tearing into this engine.

To be honest I should of done this sooner. We were going to trade it off and let the dealer worry about the repairs but this thing runs so good Im glad we kept it.

Prices.
Injector spider-175.90
Intake seal kit-26.39

My friend owns a GM dealer and sold me these parts at "wholesale" accordiing to him. I could of got them at www.gmpartsdirect.com for a little less but hes my friend & local so what the heck.

You could reuse the gaskets if you choose but I didnt want to risk it.Have a full can of carb cleaner because there is a lot of carbon build up under the plenium. I cleaned the bottom of the butterfly on the throttle body too. It would get so much build up on it the thing would stick and you had to stomp on the gas pedal to make it move..
I used a 15$ haynes manual and believe it or not it helped. It recommended using some sealant on the bolts so I used the blue locktite stuff.There was sealant on the bolts when I took them out. It must be because there isnt much torque on them. I also smeared a little anti seize on the aluminum fuel lines that connect near the firewall. Keep an eye on that connection because there are two small o rings that stayed on the truck ends of those lines. Make sure they are there before you reconnect the lines.

The hardest part is looping the lines so the intake goes back on. It seems like the lines wouldnt work with that much bend in them but they do. They are semi rigid plastic with the injectors molded on the ends so you cannot cut them. Figuring the best hose routing so the plenium would go back on took me an hour.

00 Yukon SLT XL 5.3
98 Lumina Police Package 3.8
88 2500 4X4 5.7
87 Mustang LX 5.0
67 Mustang Fastback 289
65 Mustang Fastback 289


Edited by DeLong on 01-14-07 06:16 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
01-27-07 05:10 PM - Post#1081618    
    In response to DeLong

I ordered the parts today from gmdirectparts.com. If they arrive by Friday, I may do the conversion on Saturday. I'm not sure if I'll do it myself or have a mechanic do it. I'll keep ya'all posted.

'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
01-28-07 08:49 PM - Post#1082536    
    In response to gchemist

Delong,
One question. Do the lines match up with the cylinders? Or do I need to pay special attention of the sequence order?

'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
DeLong 
Banned Member
Posts: 2868

Loc: Rural Illinois
Reg: 06-06-02
01-29-07 10:43 AM - Post#1082870    
    In response to gchemist

The lines are numbered for each cylinder on the black plastic part of the spider.Kinda hard to see but they do have to go in the correct cylinder.

IIRC they go in the engine just like they point out of the spider.

00 Yukon SLT XL 5.3
98 Lumina Police Package 3.8
88 2500 4X4 5.7
87 Mustang LX 5.0
67 Mustang Fastback 289
65 Mustang Fastback 289


Edited by gchemist on 04-02-07 04:05 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
02-17-07 02:22 PM - Post#1098607    
    In response to DeLong

Yehaaa, I installed the new FI spider this week. Man what a difference. The new FI spider is awsome. No more SES lights, smooth idle and hard accelleration. My Jimmy easily pulls 4800 RPMs through all the gears! I'll post pictures of the conversion when I find the darn cord to download the pictures from the camcorder. I noticed if the pressure regulator fails, any fuel that leaks out falls directly into the #6 cylinder. The extra fuel kept causing the misfire on the #6 cylinder. If you pull the #6 plug and its fouled compared to the others you know you have a problem with the injection system.

The FI spider sounds like a TBI without the air cleaner on. Smooth and pulsed synchronized. I recommend this conversion to anyone that has poppets!!

'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
DeLong 
Banned Member
Posts: 2868

Loc: Rural Illinois
Reg: 06-06-02
02-17-07 08:23 PM - Post#1098844    
    In response to gchemist

Nice. I look forward to the pics.

00 Yukon SLT XL 5.3
98 Lumina Police Package 3.8
88 2500 4X4 5.7
87 Mustang LX 5.0
67 Mustang Fastback 289
65 Mustang Fastback 289


 
bigman93 
Member
Posts: 47

Reg: 02-28-04
02-19-07 10:41 AM - Post#1099929    
    In response to gchemist

Could you please supply part numbers, where you got them from, and approx cost? I need to do this to my blazer. I looked at http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/
The numbers I came up with were
MFI spider 12568332
It said there that I could get the upper plenium gasket. I just want to make sure to get the right parts cause it says that they are special order parts and are non-returnable.
Thanks



 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
02-19-07 01:29 PM - Post#1100050    
    In response to bigman93

Bigman93,
I used these part numbers provided by DeLong. DeLong provided help during the conversion. Read this thread on questions I asked.
http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/showtopic.php?ti...
I'll post more information on the conversion later today.

MFI spider #12568332
Upper plenium Seal Kit #17113215
All parts I used were GM but Napa makes a kit too.
You can probably save some money by buying the gaskets locally. I did buy the parts from GM Partsdirect.


'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
bigman93 
Member
Posts: 47

Reg: 02-28-04
02-20-07 11:40 AM - Post#1100851    
    In response to gchemist

I did read that thread, thats how I found that site and numbers. I just wanted to make sure those were the right numbers cause it doesn't give much of a description.
For some reason when I type in the number for the upper plenium gasket, it says that the part number was not found.The number I used is 17113215. Did you have any problem with that number? Napa sells the gasket for $16. Their spider kit sells for $290.



 
DeLong 
Banned Member
Posts: 2868

Loc: Rural Illinois
Reg: 06-06-02
02-20-07 12:56 PM - Post#1100929    
    In response to bigman93

Id pass on the napa spider due to price. The gasket kit from GM has the upper plenium gasket and a couple more small o rings. I think they are used for the fuel line to the new throttle body. If I remember it also has a new throttle body gasket too. Its been a while since I did my jimmy so Gchemist will correct me if Im wrong.

You could call a gm dealer and ask them for the part # for your application.Im pretty sure that is the right #.

00 Yukon SLT XL 5.3
98 Lumina Police Package 3.8
88 2500 4X4 5.7
87 Mustang LX 5.0
67 Mustang Fastback 289
65 Mustang Fastback 289


 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
02-20-07 03:48 PM - Post#1101129    
    In response to DeLong

Check again, I just pulled this
GM PART # 17113215
CATEGORY: Manifold Gasket
PACK QTY: 1
CORE CHARGE: $0.00
GM LIST: $35.18
OUR PRICE: $20.85

The kit is only two gaskets. One for the throttle body and the other for the uppermanifold. You don't need orings for the fuel lines. The orings are inserted into the new spider. Just push down the fuel lines into the spider and bolt down. Order the GM spider from GM parts direct. Pricey shipping but worth it. I spent <$210 for both part numbers.

You need these parts too.
1 can of throttle body cleaner
1 can of carb cleaner for the upper manifold
1 can for the air intake sensor
1 10mm deep socket for the manifold gaskets
1 5.5mm socket for one of the TB bolts
1 small tube of thread lock or sealer. I use the small blue tube type.
A small hex set to remove the air idle valve.
Clean the EGR valve and idle air valve too.
I recommend changing the map and throttle posistion sensors.

Key notes:
1. Disconnect the battery
2. Releave the fuel pressure
3. Pull and remove the harness wire connections from the air intake sensor all the way to the sensor on the passenger side of the intake.
4. Layout all the bolts and parts on a flat surface so you know where to put them back.
5. You can bend the fuel lines back far enough to remove the intake just be careful. Otherwise to remove the fuel lines, you may need the wrenchs that can go on a socket.
6. Route the spider fuel lines just like the originals. All should run forward from the FI spider bracket. You should only loop back the #5 and #6 lines.
7. Use the carb cleaner to remove the junk from the intake.
8. Don't drop anything down the runners.
9. Once the new lines go into the intake they won't come out!!! Snap the new lines once you are sure that you won't need to remove them.
10. Use a dab of grease on the upper portion of the spider that slides up into the manifold. Use a dab of grease on manifold opening that goes over the spider. This will save you the trouble of having to push down hard on the intake to seat it.
11. Clean the TB really good. Remove the plastic weird looking thing on the TB opening plate. This will increase air flow.
12. GM did a good job on the gasket design. Just tighten the bolts to a snug. You can go back later and tighten them a little after the engine has warmed up and coold a few times. However you don't need to do this if you use the thread sealer.
13. Bolt down everything and connect the hoses.
14. Before installing the air intake hose, check for fuel leaks. Connect the battery and turn the key to ignition. Let the pump prime the line. I did several times so the pressure will buildup. If you don't see any fuel leaks, install the air intake hose, misc hoses, reconnect the sensors and wiring harness.
15. Start it up and check for fuel leaks!! Let it idle up to normal operating temperature before going for a test drive.

This is my first time doing a FI injection job. It was fairly easy. Just take your time and be careful. My Jimmy runs like a champ. I bet even my fuel milage will be better. I was down to 14 MPGin the city! I can already tell it's back to up the 16-17 mark and maybe more. Throttle response is awsome!! Idle is smooth. You'll like the conversion.

'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


Edited by gchemist on 02-20-07 04:18 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
DeLong 
Banned Member
Posts: 2868

Loc: Rural Illinois
Reg: 06-06-02
02-20-07 07:44 PM - Post#1101374    
    In response to gchemist

Nice write up. Also a good time to do a cap and rotor since all the stuff is out of your way.

00 Yukon SLT XL 5.3
98 Lumina Police Package 3.8
88 2500 4X4 5.7
87 Mustang LX 5.0
67 Mustang Fastback 289
65 Mustang Fastback 289


 
bigman93 
Member
Posts: 47

Reg: 02-28-04
02-21-07 11:43 AM - Post#1101834    
    In response to gchemist

Well I checked again and finally found it. I placed my order as well. How long did it take to get your parts?
I ordered
spider 12568332
plenium gaskit 17113215
intake gasket 12529196
valve cover gasket 10201397
I hope they all turn out to be right.
Nice write up on the injector swap.
Do you have any experience changing intake gaskets? Any tips?

Thanks



 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
02-21-07 01:42 PM - Post#1101913    
    In response to bigman93

They fedex the parts....but it takes 3 days for them to put the order in. So plan on at least a week. Are you going to remove the lower intake manifold?

I can probably do the job in less than 3 hours after doing mine. Plan on taking your time because there a lot things to move and track.

'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
bigman93 
Member
Posts: 47

Reg: 02-28-04
02-21-07 11:55 PM - Post#1102276    
    In response to gchemist

  • gchemist Said:
Are you going to remove the lower intake manifold?

I can probably do the job in less than 3 hours after doing mine. Plan on taking your time because there a lot things to move and track.



Ya, my intake gaskets have been leaking for awhile. I figure this will be the best time to fix it. I plan on making a weekend out of it.




 
bigman93 
Member
Posts: 47

Reg: 02-28-04
03-11-07 02:13 PM - Post#1116938    
    In response to gchemist

I got my truck all put back together. Changed itake gaskets, fuel injector spider, and valve cover gaskets. It runs like a champ now. I can finally drive it out of town again. All of it was pretty easy and straight forward. And no left over hardware.

  • gchemist Said:

11. Clean the TB really good. Remove the plastic weird looking thing on the TB opening plate. This will increase air flow.




Are you talking about the piece on the throttle plate? If so how did you take it off and what did you do about the rivits holding it on.





 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
03-11-07 04:44 PM - Post#1117016    
    In response to bigman93

I found this topic after I did the conversion. The modification will be helpful since I now run 29" tires compared to 27.1" stock tires. The low end throttle response will help over some some of the lost torque. I'm undecided on which way to go. Either order the marine plate or just grind it off. I'll have to take a look next time I do maintenance on the Jimmy.

'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
Buoyhunter 
Member
Posts: 12

Loc: Lower Michigan
Reg: 10-30-06
03-14-07 05:55 AM - Post#1119338    
    In response to gchemist

This part no. 12568332 is the whole spider unit for the V-6 4.3L?? I could only find listings/part numbers for individual injectors... And my local parts depot wanted 460+ dollars for six of them.



 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
03-14-07 08:17 AM - Post#1119441    
    In response to Buoyhunter

Yes, here are the part numbers I used for the conversion.
GM PART # 17113215 rubber gaskets
MFI spider #12568332
Here is the original post by Delong
http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/showtopic.php?ti...



'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
DeLong 
Banned Member
Posts: 2868

Loc: Rural Illinois
Reg: 06-06-02
03-14-07 04:19 PM - Post#1119860    
    In response to Buoyhunter

They quoted you replacement poppets.

Get the MFI spider upgrade gchemist has been so kind to list& detail the install. Cheaper, better and you'll love it.

EDIT: Yes, the spider is one whole piece, regulator,injectors everything you need but gaskets.

00 Yukon SLT XL 5.3
98 Lumina Police Package 3.8
88 2500 4X4 5.7
87 Mustang LX 5.0
67 Mustang Fastback 289
65 Mustang Fastback 289


Edited by DeLong on 03-14-07 04:24 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
04-02-07 04:11 PM - Post#1134239    
    In response to bigman93

Finally, y'all get the first look at the photos I took during the upgrade. I've never been so happy to see a dead spider!! The new turantula is awsome!!

Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/user/gchemist

Short cut: http://rides.webshots.com/album/557928095EiAjZP

'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
Kwall 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 46
Kwall
Age: 60
Loc: Oregon (Portland area)
Reg: 04-08-08
04-08-08 06:10 AM - Post#1406590    
    In response to DeLong

Hi DeLong,
I am getting ready to do the MFI conversion to my 1997 Blazert LT. I purchased the 12568332 & have the gasket kit but no bracket. I noticed you said you didn't need the new bracket. Did you have to modify the old one or did it work as-is?

Thank you for your time & advice

Kent

Kwall
-----------------
1997 Blazer
1988 K2500
Lotsa guitars


 
gchemist 
Senior Chevytalk Moderator
Posts: 24203
gchemist
Loc: Austin, TX 78748
Reg: 05-09-00
04-09-08 09:04 AM - Post#1407610    
    In response to Kwall

Hi Kent,
Your engine should be just like mine. You don't need the bracket. The new spider will fit on the current one.

Has the intake gasket ever been replaced on your engine? If not, go ahead and remove the entire intake together.


After removal. Installing the new FI spider is easy.

'95 Jimmy SLT (Bought @131,814)
'83 Silverardo XST - ZZ4 powered
'96 GMC Jimmy LS Ret. @236651 miles


 
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