Levon
Forum Newbie
Posts: 49
Reg: 05-06-09
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04-18-12 04:55 PM - Post#2216643
Hello all, I want to replace the cast iron head starter on my 62 Impala, 327 with headers. I want to use the smaller starter due to the fact that once my starter gets hot, it takes awhile to restart the car once it's shut off. My question is do they make a small starter to replace my starter which bolts into the bell housing and not through the bottom of the engine block? Thanks in advance.
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 DonSSDD
Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 4657
Loc: Nova Scotia, Canada
Reg: 08-21-01
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04-18-12 05:03 PM - Post#2216647
In response to Levon
Yes, I got one from a local starter place. They had to order it in but they had a listing for it.
Don
59 El Camino, 62 Bel Air SC, 62 Bel Air SC(sold in Finland is 2011), 63 SWC Vette (sold)
Member #2194 |
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doubleE
Valued Contributor
Posts: 3682
Loc: Eagan MN
Reg: 06-02-03
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04-18-12 05:25 PM - Post#2216658
In response to DonSSDD
This has always puzzled me. I know the mini starters with the bell houseing mount exist as I have seen them but I have never seen them listed in any catalogs or web sites. Chevy used the bell mount style for several years on both cars and trucks includeing the ever popular Tri-5 years... one would think there would be enough demand for mini-high torq units to be more available.
Even the stock style bell mount starters are hard to find 
Eric
| Proud owner of
My Blue 62
Impala SS |
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Carl1962
Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 580
Loc: Australia
Reg: 04-01-10
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04-19-12 02:07 AM - Post#2216786
In response to doubleE
Is there any advantage to the bell housing starter? Why would it make any difference? It it a difference between having an auto or manual?
When I pulled my 327 last year to clean up the engine bay, I took the opportunity to replace my unreliable original starter (solenoid wouldn't always engage), which weighed about 17 lb with a 3hp high torque mini starter weighing less than 8 lb. It is heaps better, turns the engine over so fast you'll think all the plugs are pulled out and has never let me down. See it on ebay here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SBC-BBC-CHEVY-3HP -High-Tor...
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models916
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 1861
Age: 62
Loc: Addison, IL
Reg: 05-28-10
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04-19-12 06:04 AM - Post#2216818
In response to Levon
You might give these guys a call. Pretty sure this fits but you have to get the rotation correct. Some are CCW some are not.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-STARTER-CRUSA DER-327-3...
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55rue
Forum Newbie
Posts: 1
Reg: 04-19-12
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04-19-12 09:08 AM - Post#2216879
In response to models916
The new starter shown is for a 153 tooth flywheel. Don't most have the 168 tooth flywheel, just wondering...
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ImpalaSS62
Contributor
Posts: 149
Loc: England
Reg: 10-18-08
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04-19-12 12:10 PM - Post#2216939
In response to 55rue
I could never get the smaller hi-torque motor to engage no matter how many or little shims were used. Just never engaged properly.
Went and got a rebuilt original unit and it went straight on and worked perfectly.
To stop the overheating problem I went to a plumbing store and bought 2 heat mats for pipe soldering and wrapped them around the starter case held in place with some strong wire.
No more hot starts! Worked a charm...! 
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 dcairns
"4th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1530
Loc: Orange CA
Reg: 11-07-03
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04-19-12 04:22 PM - Post#2217018
In response to ImpalaSS62
I used to have this same problem with the hot start. Unfortunately, I changed too many things at the same time to be sure what the actual cure was. New engine, new starter, new wiring. However, many say that the old wiring degrades and when it gets hot and does not work as well as it used to. They do make a kit that uses the old ignition wiring to trigger a small solenoid which in turn handles the power to the solenoid of the starter. It is supposed to be a potential cure for the problem. But I as I said, I can't say from my own experience what works.
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62impala409
Contributor
Posts: 245
Loc: Burnsville, MN
Reg: 06-30-10
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04-19-12 05:10 PM - Post#2217035
In response to dcairns
One of the reasons for for a slow cranking starter on a hot motor is because the copper field windings expand from the heat and short out due to the compromised old varnish coating used for insulating the copper wire. The new style minne starters use a magnetic field in place of the copper winding and are not affected by engine heat. Another cause of starter problems can be a cheap offshore starter solenoid that won't flow enough current to turn over a warmed up motor. Delco-Remy always used a solenoid with more windings for their high performance motors.
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DonSSDD
Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 4657
Loc: Nova Scotia, Canada
Reg: 08-21-01
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04-19-12 05:14 PM - Post#2217037
In response to dcairns
The bell housing mount starter requires a 168 tooth flywheel or flexplate. The advantage to the BH mount starter is they align themselves, no need for shims. The same starter fits the auto or manual and it may be the later model truck BH mount ones will fit the old cars too?
Go to an old fashioned shop that rebuilds starters, generators, and alternators, that's where I found my mini. They also helped me rewire it since I have a Pertronics.
Don
59 El Camino, 62 Bel Air SC, 62 Bel Air SC(sold in Finland is 2011), 63 SWC Vette (sold)
Member #2194 |
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 Red64SS
"3rd Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 316
Loc: Georgia
Reg: 10-04-10
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04-20-12 01:26 PM - Post#2217310
In response to Carl1962
Is there any advantage to the bell housing starter? Why would it make any difference? It it a difference between having an auto or manual?
When I pulled my 327 last year to clean up the engine bay, I took the opportunity to replace my unreliable original starter (solenoid wouldn't always engage), which weighed about 17 lb with a 3hp high torque mini starter weighing less than 8 lb. It is heaps better, turns the engine over so fast you'll think all the plugs are pulled out and has never let me down. See it on ebay here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SBC-BBC-CHEVY-3HP -High-Tor...
I hope it works, because I just bought one of these based on your reccomendation. The posts below yours were of concern. I won't be able to try it until I build my 327 for my 2-dr post.
64 Impala SS AC convertible 65K mile survivor.
Almost identical to the first new car I ever bought back in 1964
64 Bel Air 2-door sedan 327 w/factory AC (project)
2007 Silverado Classic 2500 diesel
1977 Porsche 911S
1972 BMW 3.0 CSL
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Carl1962
Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 580
Loc: Australia
Reg: 04-01-10
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04-20-12 03:51 PM - Post#2217355
In response to Red64SS
I hope you did your homework first. That particular starter has the straight bolt hole line up and is for a 153 tooth flywheel which is what I used for a 327 and Powerglide. The other sort of mini starter is for 168 tooth flywheels.
Plus you're taking a much lesser risk than I did, because the shipping to Australia for a $60 starter motor is more than the cost of the starter! If it didn't work, there was no chance I would be returning it for refund.
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Levon
Forum Newbie
Posts: 49
Reg: 05-06-09
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04-23-12 01:13 PM - Post#2218300
In response to Carl1962
Thanks for all the replies. I placed a shield over the solenoid, but wound up with the same problem. I was at a swap/show over the weekend and I chatted with some enthusists, who stated that my problem might be with vapor lock. I was told to remove my original gas cap and see if the car starts after driving it for a time.
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doubleE
Valued Contributor
Posts: 3682
Loc: Eagan MN
Reg: 06-02-03
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04-23-12 04:37 PM - Post#2218386
In response to Levon
I was at a swap/show over the weekend and I chatted with some enthusists, who stated that my problem might be with vapor lock. I was told to remove my original gas cap and see if the car starts after driving it for a time.
So the question is - when the car won't start, is it cranking over? I think most all of us assumed your engine was not turning over (cranking) by the way you described the problem.
If if won't turn over it's a starter motor problem. If it is cranking over but not firing, it could be vapor lock or a weak ignition part like a coil.
Eric
| Proud owner of
My Blue 62
Impala SS |
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Levon
Forum Newbie
Posts: 49
Reg: 05-06-09
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04-24-12 02:01 PM - Post#2218713
In response to doubleE
It spins over rather normally after driving it for an hour. It just doesn't "catch" and start up. If I leave it for about a half hour it will start then.
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Levon
Forum Newbie
Posts: 49
Reg: 05-06-09
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04-24-12 02:06 PM - Post#2218714
In response to Levon
Also, I have a Pertronix ignition with a 40,000 volt coil and I beleive Moroso wires.
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